WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.730 --> 00:00:04.206 Hello, everyone. My name is Joanne Lockwood, and I am your host. The 2 00:00:04.228 --> 00:00:07.966 Inclusion Bites podcast. In this series, I will be interviewing a 3 00:00:07.988 --> 00:00:11.806 number of amazing people and simply having a conversation around the subject of 4 00:00:11.828 --> 00:00:15.518 inclusion, belonging and generally making the world a better place for everyone to 5 00:00:15.524 --> 00:00:19.066 thrive in. If you'd like to join me in the future, then please do drop 6 00:00:19.098 --> 00:00:22.622 me a line to jo.Lockwood@seechangehappen.co.uk 7 00:00:22.676 --> 00:00:24.190 and that's 8 00:00:27.050 --> 00:00:30.098 you be able to catch up with all of the episodes on itunes, Spotify and 9 00:00:30.194 --> 00:00:33.718 all the usual places. So plug in your headphones, grab a decaf 10 00:00:33.724 --> 00:00:37.318 and let's get going. Today is 11 00:00:37.484 --> 00:00:41.258 episode six with the title It's all about acceptance 12 00:00:41.344 --> 00:00:44.746 and authenticity in order to be able to achieve. 13 00:00:44.768 --> 00:00:48.506 I have the absolute honour and privilege to be joined 14 00:00:48.528 --> 00:00:52.242 by Michael Jarasi. I met Michael 15 00:00:52.326 --> 00:00:55.946 randomly on LinkedIn, like you do, and Michael described 16 00:00:55.978 --> 00:00:59.674 himself as a transformational life coach. So I asked Michael 17 00:00:59.722 --> 00:01:03.502 to tell me about his superpower and he said he's an active listener 18 00:01:03.566 --> 00:01:07.390 and full of compassion. So hello, Michael, 19 00:01:07.470 --> 00:01:11.022 welcome to the show. Lovely to be here, joanne, I'm excited 20 00:01:11.086 --> 00:01:14.020 to chat to you today. So tell, 21 00:01:14.470 --> 00:01:18.166 why is it all about acceptance and authenticity in 22 00:01:18.188 --> 00:01:21.862 order to be able to achieve? Well, actually, for me, I believe 23 00:01:21.916 --> 00:01:25.746 this is my philosophy when working with clients. I call it AAA. 24 00:01:25.858 --> 00:01:29.514 It's an easy abbreviation to remember. You think 25 00:01:29.552 --> 00:01:33.274 of your AAA batteries, and here today, I hope 26 00:01:33.312 --> 00:01:36.810 to kind of supercharge people's journey into 27 00:01:36.880 --> 00:01:40.566 success and achieving. Wow. AAA 28 00:01:40.598 --> 00:01:43.420 batteries. So they're fully rechargeable. So 29 00:01:45.150 --> 00:01:48.426 you pop on charge overnight or a good session with you and that charges people's 30 00:01:48.458 --> 00:01:52.190 batteries run up again. That's right. And I think it's important 31 00:01:52.260 --> 00:01:55.810 to know your own values, to be able to navigate 32 00:01:56.390 --> 00:01:59.540 success and know which direction to go in. 33 00:02:00.150 --> 00:02:03.954 So how does your superpower of your 34 00:02:03.992 --> 00:02:07.718 listening compassion come into that, to play in 35 00:02:07.724 --> 00:02:11.186 that? Well, when I tell people my superpower is active 36 00:02:11.218 --> 00:02:14.966 listening, a lot of people think, oh, my God, listening is so easy, anyone can 37 00:02:14.988 --> 00:02:18.540 do that. But in actual fact, 38 00:02:19.550 --> 00:02:22.650 it takes a lot of concentration to listen to someone 39 00:02:22.720 --> 00:02:26.410 properly, especially not giving them advice. 40 00:02:27.070 --> 00:02:30.442 A lot of family members will think that they're listening to you, but in actual 41 00:02:30.496 --> 00:02:34.174 fact tell you what to do. So I 42 00:02:34.212 --> 00:02:37.342 think it's important to be able to take what 43 00:02:37.396 --> 00:02:41.182 someone's saying and let them have the opportunity 44 00:02:41.316 --> 00:02:45.086 to make the decisions themselves. Yeah, 45 00:02:45.108 --> 00:02:48.658 that's a really good point. I know myself sometimes when 46 00:02:48.824 --> 00:02:52.638 I'm zoned out, I've got my black mirror in my hand, I'm playing 47 00:02:52.654 --> 00:02:56.146 with my phone, my mind's elsewhere and someone's trying to talk to me. I know 48 00:02:56.168 --> 00:02:59.494 myself that sometimes I'm not giving people that respect of 49 00:02:59.532 --> 00:03:03.334 listening. And not only I'm not listening, I'm not hearing them either, 50 00:03:03.372 --> 00:03:06.886 I'm not hearing their words. So what sort of techniques have you 51 00:03:06.908 --> 00:03:10.586 learned in order to help yourself become an active listener? I 52 00:03:10.608 --> 00:03:14.458 think today in the modern world, we have so many distractions and 53 00:03:14.544 --> 00:03:18.250 that could be your phone, it could be the television, so I have to 54 00:03:18.320 --> 00:03:22.110 switch everything off. I dedicate that 55 00:03:22.180 --> 00:03:26.014 specific time to my clients and ensure that 56 00:03:26.052 --> 00:03:29.726 I'm completely concentrated on the conversation. And 57 00:03:29.828 --> 00:03:33.394 whenever I do work with clients, I tend to reflect back 58 00:03:33.512 --> 00:03:37.154 what they're saying to be sure that what I've understood is 59 00:03:37.192 --> 00:03:40.562 correct. And my second 60 00:03:40.616 --> 00:03:44.274 superpower I did mention is compassion. And I think it's important 61 00:03:44.392 --> 00:03:48.198 to be able to truly understand your client in order to be able to 62 00:03:48.204 --> 00:03:51.814 help them in their 63 00:03:51.932 --> 00:03:55.526 endeavours. Yeah. No, I completely agree. I think 64 00:03:55.548 --> 00:03:59.366 compassion is something that I think is a very human trait 65 00:03:59.398 --> 00:04:03.194 and something we often don't use enough. We 66 00:04:03.232 --> 00:04:06.714 often jump to judgement without using our 67 00:04:06.752 --> 00:04:10.314 compassion first. Would you say that you use 68 00:04:10.352 --> 00:04:14.174 compassion in your own work? I do. Personally, I think 69 00:04:14.212 --> 00:04:17.770 I'm sure I do. And it's trying to blend empathy, 70 00:04:17.850 --> 00:04:21.626 compassion, vulnerability, allowing somebody else to be vulnerable 71 00:04:21.738 --> 00:04:25.294 and that someone else to show to talk about 72 00:04:25.332 --> 00:04:28.386 themselves and give them that space to be able to communicate in that way. And 73 00:04:28.408 --> 00:04:31.902 I think having someone listen to you is a really powerful 74 00:04:31.966 --> 00:04:35.650 thing that not everybody experiences. And when you have had someone 75 00:04:35.720 --> 00:04:39.478 just listen to you without saying a word, it is so powerful. So 76 00:04:39.564 --> 00:04:42.760 that must be something that you're experiencing often. 77 00:04:43.130 --> 00:04:46.200 Yeah, I mean, I've had clients before that have 78 00:04:46.730 --> 00:04:50.220 told me sincerely that they've never felt listened to ever. 79 00:04:50.750 --> 00:04:54.490 And for them it's quite a magical experience that someone is 80 00:04:54.560 --> 00:04:58.138 very much dedicated their time to them and 81 00:04:58.304 --> 00:05:01.858 towards their own. Well, it's 82 00:05:01.894 --> 00:05:05.374 interesting, I seem to remember when we met back in the days when you could 83 00:05:05.412 --> 00:05:09.150 meet physically. We're obviously in the height of 84 00:05:09.220 --> 00:05:12.746 lockdown season, it's the new norm, apparently. 85 00:05:12.938 --> 00:05:16.334 But we met in London, didn't we? And I remember we sat down for probably 86 00:05:16.372 --> 00:05:19.582 what I thought was going to be a half hour meeting or half hour conversation 87 00:05:19.726 --> 00:05:22.180 and I think it was about 4 hours later. And 88 00:05:23.110 --> 00:05:26.558 although I felt drained, it was a very cathartic experience 89 00:05:26.744 --> 00:05:30.146 because you are a very good listening and I hadn't 90 00:05:30.178 --> 00:05:34.006 realised that that was what was happening until afterwards. So it was a very 91 00:05:34.028 --> 00:05:37.478 powerful process. And I've probably talked 92 00:05:37.564 --> 00:05:41.290 more to you about stuff than I've ever talked to somebody else 93 00:05:41.440 --> 00:05:45.178 because you are such an engaging listener, if you 94 00:05:45.184 --> 00:05:49.034 like. And you were able to just prompt me every so often with 95 00:05:49.072 --> 00:05:52.838 some additional bits of conversation that just kept me pouring it out, 96 00:05:52.864 --> 00:05:56.650 if you like. Well, you know, Joanne, I always enjoy our conversations 97 00:05:56.730 --> 00:06:00.526 together and whenever we plan to have a quick call, it 98 00:06:00.548 --> 00:06:04.254 always ends up being a few hours I love 99 00:06:04.292 --> 00:06:08.066 to have a chat with. So do you 100 00:06:08.088 --> 00:06:11.778 find maybe when you're doing coaching that 101 00:06:11.864 --> 00:06:15.378 it takes a while for people to open up? I mean, are people used to 102 00:06:15.544 --> 00:06:18.758 being able to be honest and vulnerable with you? I mean, is that something they 103 00:06:18.764 --> 00:06:22.578 have to learn themselves. It really depends on the client. 104 00:06:22.754 --> 00:06:25.590 Usually I work with clients for about six sessions 105 00:06:26.570 --> 00:06:30.202 and that allows us to kind of go deep into the 106 00:06:30.256 --> 00:06:33.946 topic or challenge that they have. But for 107 00:06:33.968 --> 00:06:37.546 some clients, maybe only a few sessions would be 108 00:06:37.568 --> 00:06:41.134 enough. It really depends how 109 00:06:41.252 --> 00:06:45.054 long it might take them to go into 110 00:06:45.092 --> 00:06:48.800 the topic or how vulnerable they're able to be from the get go 111 00:06:49.730 --> 00:06:53.310 in order to see change. Do you 112 00:06:53.380 --> 00:06:56.260 ever find that you've opened a box 113 00:06:56.870 --> 00:07:00.594 and they let something out that's really hard for them to 114 00:07:00.632 --> 00:07:04.306 process at that time? Or do you find generally people are 115 00:07:04.328 --> 00:07:07.080 quite reserved still and you have to tease things out of them. 116 00:07:07.770 --> 00:07:11.458 So people come to me as a coach because they feel stuck and they don't 117 00:07:11.474 --> 00:07:14.520 know what the next step is. So 118 00:07:15.210 --> 00:07:19.020 they wouldn't be coming to me if they knew what to do. 119 00:07:20.910 --> 00:07:24.522 There is a challenge around that. But 120 00:07:24.656 --> 00:07:28.282 sometimes I do get clients that are confused between 121 00:07:28.336 --> 00:07:31.874 what coaching is compared to, for example, counselling or mentoring, 122 00:07:31.942 --> 00:07:35.486 when all three are quite different. And so if 123 00:07:35.588 --> 00:07:38.766 there is a topic that feels more towards the 124 00:07:38.868 --> 00:07:42.350 counselling angle, I wouldn't be able to help them in that respect. 125 00:07:43.010 --> 00:07:46.338 Okay, so counselling is where you're trying to resolve a problem, coaching is where you're 126 00:07:46.344 --> 00:07:49.794 trying to unlock yourself. Is that the difference? So 127 00:07:49.832 --> 00:07:53.374 counselling is helping to cure 128 00:07:53.502 --> 00:07:56.674 past trauma that you might have had, whereas 129 00:07:56.802 --> 00:08:00.582 coaching looks at what is going on for you now and how is that 130 00:08:00.636 --> 00:08:04.438 affecting your future. And so it's always future looking 131 00:08:04.524 --> 00:08:08.338 in that sense. It's also non advisory as well. So 132 00:08:08.364 --> 00:08:11.802 that's the main difference between coaching and mentoring. For example. 133 00:08:11.936 --> 00:08:15.626 Yeah, I remember doing an Introduction to 134 00:08:15.648 --> 00:08:19.466 Coaching course myself a couple of years ago, and some of 135 00:08:19.488 --> 00:08:22.560 the exercise we did were really powerful where 136 00:08:23.090 --> 00:08:26.810 even by the way you look, a gesture, 137 00:08:26.890 --> 00:08:30.590 a body movement, or even the way you respond with a certain tone 138 00:08:30.930 --> 00:08:34.042 can almost imply approval or disapproval 139 00:08:34.186 --> 00:08:37.938 or acknowledgment or recognition. And you've also got to try and 140 00:08:37.944 --> 00:08:41.698 be very neutral in your reactions to someone when they talk to you in a 141 00:08:41.704 --> 00:08:45.138 coaching model, haven't they? Yeah, I mean, the main focus of 142 00:08:45.304 --> 00:08:48.966 a coaching conversation are the powerful questions. And so 143 00:08:48.988 --> 00:08:51.400 it's very much how you word those questions 144 00:08:52.410 --> 00:08:56.114 because you don't want to be asking closed questions or leading 145 00:08:56.162 --> 00:08:59.066 questions, because then that's essentially giving them 146 00:08:59.248 --> 00:09:02.874 subconscious advice. And 147 00:09:02.912 --> 00:09:05.290 that's not the point of a coaching conversation. 148 00:09:06.830 --> 00:09:10.570 Yes, you're not after a yes or no type answer with a right or wrong. 149 00:09:10.720 --> 00:09:13.806 It's kind of a how do you feel? Or what does that look like to 150 00:09:13.828 --> 00:09:17.662 you? Or what does that feel like to you? What does success feel like 151 00:09:17.796 --> 00:09:21.626 questions. Isn't that exactly you've got it down perfectly. You'll 152 00:09:21.658 --> 00:09:25.454 be stealing my job next. I still remember the course I did 153 00:09:25.492 --> 00:09:29.278 and the grow model and all this other stuff and the learning ladders 154 00:09:29.294 --> 00:09:32.818 and all this kind of stuff. I remember the wheel of life or whatever the 155 00:09:32.824 --> 00:09:35.860 techniques are. Yeah. But I think today 156 00:09:36.410 --> 00:09:39.718 a lot of people either focus on academics or their 157 00:09:39.884 --> 00:09:43.186 physical well being and often forget their own mental 158 00:09:43.218 --> 00:09:46.934 state and how that can impact where they're going 159 00:09:46.972 --> 00:09:49.980 in their purpose or direction in life. And so 160 00:09:50.910 --> 00:09:54.300 a coaching session really allows someone to 161 00:09:56.990 --> 00:10:00.618 focus on that and also invest in themselves for 162 00:10:00.704 --> 00:10:03.950 that hour or a few hours that they have with the coach. 163 00:10:05.250 --> 00:10:08.766 Yeah. So what got you into coaching in the first place? I mean, you like 164 00:10:08.788 --> 00:10:12.606 listening to people or you just came into it by 165 00:10:12.628 --> 00:10:16.434 mistake or by accident or was it a lifeguard? Well, I 166 00:10:16.472 --> 00:10:20.014 actually had a life changing experience when I volunteered as a massage 167 00:10:20.062 --> 00:10:23.886 therapist for St Joseph's Hospice in Hackney in East 168 00:10:23.918 --> 00:10:27.540 London. I was volunteering in the 169 00:10:28.010 --> 00:10:31.574 palliative care unit where I was working with people in end of 170 00:10:31.612 --> 00:10:35.286 life. And going into it, I thought that people would be 171 00:10:35.308 --> 00:10:38.950 quite sad and kind of ready to kind of complete 172 00:10:39.020 --> 00:10:41.820 their life when in actual fact, 173 00:10:42.510 --> 00:10:45.994 most of the patients that I worked with really had a zest for 174 00:10:46.032 --> 00:10:49.514 life and that's what inspired me. And I 175 00:10:49.552 --> 00:10:53.210 meant that I wanted to kind of take that zest 176 00:10:53.370 --> 00:10:56.734 and have that same outlook in my own life and also help other 177 00:10:56.772 --> 00:10:58.880 people do the same. 178 00:11:00.610 --> 00:11:03.520 Wow, that's quite a life changing moment. 179 00:11:05.030 --> 00:11:08.338 I've never worked in that kind of environment or been around people in that kind 180 00:11:08.344 --> 00:11:12.062 of situation. I've never physically 181 00:11:12.126 --> 00:11:15.442 avoided it, but it's not something that I would think 182 00:11:15.496 --> 00:11:18.440 of working with people at that stage of their life. 183 00:11:20.890 --> 00:11:24.726 It's quite a challenging thing to do. Whenever I would 184 00:11:24.748 --> 00:11:28.540 meet a new patient, they would always be excited to tell me their story 185 00:11:29.310 --> 00:11:32.938 or little anecdotes about their life and 186 00:11:33.104 --> 00:11:36.794 couldn't wait to see my reaction to the stories that they would 187 00:11:36.832 --> 00:11:40.654 tell me. And that kind of 188 00:11:40.692 --> 00:11:44.414 excitement was wonderful to see in someone, 189 00:11:44.532 --> 00:11:47.840 maybe in the last few moments that they would have. 190 00:11:50.850 --> 00:11:54.366 I watch people's stories on television, in documentaries, where 191 00:11:54.468 --> 00:11:58.306 they're going through their end of life parenthood scare typing, and I 192 00:11:58.328 --> 00:12:01.570 get so emotionally connected with people, even through the television, 193 00:12:02.070 --> 00:12:05.682 I'm not sure that I could isolate my own self 194 00:12:05.736 --> 00:12:09.214 enough to be in that environment on a day in, day out basis. So that 195 00:12:09.272 --> 00:12:12.482 I got to admire the fact you can do that and you're able to partition 196 00:12:12.546 --> 00:12:16.374 that off in your head somehow. Thank you. I mean, it was 197 00:12:16.412 --> 00:12:20.234 definitely extremely rewarding and I really enjoyed my experience there. 198 00:12:20.272 --> 00:12:23.962 It became one of the highlights of my week, going 199 00:12:24.016 --> 00:12:26.250 into the hospice and helping the patients. 200 00:12:32.110 --> 00:12:35.766 The dangers, I'm going to say the word, some sort of false 201 00:12:35.798 --> 00:12:39.120 platitudes. And no, I do mean this with all sincerity, that 202 00:12:39.570 --> 00:12:43.040 it's quite a valuable thing that you're able to do there. 203 00:12:43.730 --> 00:12:47.458 So we mentioned the COVID thing, we're right in the 204 00:12:47.464 --> 00:12:51.234 middle of this and whilst this podcast will be on the internet, I hope 205 00:12:51.272 --> 00:12:54.734 for a long time to come. It's worth maybe putting a marker in the ground 206 00:12:54.782 --> 00:12:57.960 at this time, like the end of May, beginning of June 2020, 207 00:12:58.890 --> 00:13:02.566 to sort of try and reflect on some of the challenges you're seeing 208 00:13:02.748 --> 00:13:06.258 with people, some of your people. You're coaching or maybe you're 209 00:13:06.274 --> 00:13:09.480 observing behaviours from leaders or team members 210 00:13:09.870 --> 00:13:13.674 and what people could be maybe doing better or what help people would 211 00:13:13.712 --> 00:13:17.546 use with in terms of your speciality, which is 212 00:13:17.568 --> 00:13:21.342 coaching. So what are you saying at the moment? I think times 213 00:13:21.396 --> 00:13:24.880 like this are extremely important 214 00:13:25.490 --> 00:13:28.910 in speaking to a coach because we're really 215 00:13:29.060 --> 00:13:32.634 in uncertain times, we don't know what the next step is. And 216 00:13:32.692 --> 00:13:36.418 so having someone that is there to support you 217 00:13:36.504 --> 00:13:40.274 or to help you kind of figure out what might 218 00:13:40.312 --> 00:13:43.620 be right for you and it could be to do with 219 00:13:45.450 --> 00:13:49.190 the relationships with the people that you have that you're currently 220 00:13:49.260 --> 00:13:52.918 living with. So because we're at the 221 00:13:52.924 --> 00:13:56.738 moment maybe stuck in a home or self isolated altogether, 222 00:13:56.834 --> 00:14:00.506 it can be complicated at times, or it 223 00:14:00.528 --> 00:14:04.282 could be maybe you've lost your job because 224 00:14:04.336 --> 00:14:07.994 of the pandemic and figuring out what the next step is in terms of your 225 00:14:08.032 --> 00:14:11.518 career or how can you 226 00:14:11.604 --> 00:14:14.720 improve your confidence in this type of situation. 227 00:14:15.970 --> 00:14:19.630 There are loads of different topics that people might want to discuss. 228 00:14:19.700 --> 00:14:23.394 In actual fact, at the moment, I'm offering my 229 00:14:23.432 --> 00:14:27.140 coaching through a website called More Happy to 230 00:14:28.470 --> 00:14:31.906 frontline key Workers and people who Have Lost Their 231 00:14:31.928 --> 00:14:35.698 Businesses because of COVID and I Hope to be 232 00:14:35.704 --> 00:14:39.314 Able To support the people that have been affected. So 233 00:14:39.352 --> 00:14:43.126 more happy. That's M-O-R-E-H-A-P-P-I. Is that 234 00:14:43.148 --> 00:14:46.966 right? That's right, yes. And people can obviously Google that and find out 235 00:14:46.988 --> 00:14:50.694 more if they want to. Yeah. And they can look up my profile 236 00:14:50.742 --> 00:14:53.130 on there. Oh, fantastic. 237 00:14:55.790 --> 00:14:59.354 We talk about authentic leadership and we see 238 00:14:59.472 --> 00:15:02.942 leaders, if you like, themselves, having to adjust this 239 00:15:02.996 --> 00:15:03.600 change. 240 00:15:07.010 --> 00:15:09.840 I speak often about the fact that we sometimes 241 00:15:12.290 --> 00:15:15.906 transform people from being a team member into a leader without always giving them the 242 00:15:15.928 --> 00:15:19.666 right tools in order to be a great leader. And I 243 00:15:19.688 --> 00:15:22.994 think none of us were prepared for this lockdown, none of us were 244 00:15:23.032 --> 00:15:26.822 prepared to go completely virtual or not many of us were. So 245 00:15:26.876 --> 00:15:30.646 I think leaders themselves are everyone's looking to them for 246 00:15:30.668 --> 00:15:34.390 guidance, everyone's looking to them for leadership and direction and 247 00:15:34.460 --> 00:15:38.294 they struggle themselves, aren't they? And not every leader has 248 00:15:38.332 --> 00:15:41.862 got the tools in their own toolbox to self coach, 249 00:15:41.926 --> 00:15:45.766 self manage, to self motivate in this time. They've 250 00:15:45.798 --> 00:15:49.546 got their own struggles. So what advice would you give to someone who's maybe 251 00:15:49.568 --> 00:15:53.054 in a leadership role about how to maybe look after themselves, 252 00:15:53.252 --> 00:15:56.880 put their own oxygen mask on and also help their team? 253 00:15:58.050 --> 00:16:01.822 I guess a lot of leaders end up kind of jumping into the deep end 254 00:16:01.876 --> 00:16:05.554 because that is the role that they've been given and they forget their own self 255 00:16:05.592 --> 00:16:09.154 development. And I think it's important to 256 00:16:09.192 --> 00:16:13.042 look at how your own growth and how your new 257 00:16:13.096 --> 00:16:16.822 kind of leadership title has affected you and how you plan 258 00:16:16.876 --> 00:16:20.182 to build your relationships with your colleagues and 259 00:16:20.236 --> 00:16:23.480 staff and 260 00:16:24.250 --> 00:16:27.990 how can you? Better. Maybe, for example, manage your work life balance. 261 00:16:28.590 --> 00:16:32.406 At the moment, there's so much push 262 00:16:32.438 --> 00:16:35.500 and pull from either your work or your family, and 263 00:16:36.830 --> 00:16:40.346 a lot of people don't know how to navigate that. So 264 00:16:40.528 --> 00:16:44.366 it's a topic that I work with clients a lot actually, on how to 265 00:16:44.388 --> 00:16:48.094 manage their time better. Yeah, because 266 00:16:48.212 --> 00:16:51.838 this is also because you don't drive home, get on the train. 267 00:16:52.004 --> 00:16:55.838 Some people are feeling like a slave to the black mirror, 268 00:16:55.854 --> 00:16:59.554 aren't they? They're feeling like they've got to work when they can, they're getting 269 00:16:59.592 --> 00:17:03.410 up earlier, they're working later, or because 270 00:17:03.480 --> 00:17:06.718 maybe they've got other responsibilities, whether that's childcare 271 00:17:06.814 --> 00:17:10.170 or they're caring for relatives or they're 272 00:17:10.270 --> 00:17:13.858 performing other shopping tasks or whatever else they may be doing, they've almost felt they've 273 00:17:13.874 --> 00:17:17.634 got to make up time. So people I think I'm hearing that people are burning 274 00:17:17.682 --> 00:17:21.346 out more and getting more and more stressed. They're certainly burning out from zoom calls 275 00:17:21.378 --> 00:17:24.886 and video calls now, aren't they? I think at the moment, a lot of 276 00:17:24.908 --> 00:17:28.534 parents have to suddenly homeschool their children at the same time 277 00:17:28.572 --> 00:17:31.120 as continue doing their own job and 278 00:17:32.450 --> 00:17:35.774 understanding how to manage that. At the same time, 279 00:17:35.972 --> 00:17:39.774 with quite maybe active children, how can you keep them 280 00:17:39.812 --> 00:17:43.614 entertained but also be continuing your 281 00:17:43.652 --> 00:17:47.460 professional life? It can be quite difficult to manage. 282 00:17:48.310 --> 00:17:51.858 Obviously, as a coach, you're not here to sort of solve anyone's problem. You're not 283 00:17:51.864 --> 00:17:55.394 here to sort of come up with all the thoughts and answers yourself. But 284 00:17:55.432 --> 00:17:58.854 what kind of questions would you ask somebody who is 285 00:17:58.892 --> 00:18:02.726 maybe feeling a bit sort of trapped or in that locked in a cycle? How 286 00:18:02.748 --> 00:18:06.406 would you help them unlock that? Well, my role as a 287 00:18:06.428 --> 00:18:10.154 coach is to empower the person to understand their own 288 00:18:10.192 --> 00:18:13.594 situation. So I wouldn't be able to give you 289 00:18:13.712 --> 00:18:17.082 example questions that I would ask them because it would really 290 00:18:17.216 --> 00:18:20.942 depend on the conversation and what they would like to bring up. 291 00:18:21.076 --> 00:18:24.910 So whenever I work with a client, the questions are 292 00:18:24.980 --> 00:18:26.750 unique to that client. 293 00:18:31.570 --> 00:18:35.300 If I worked from template questions, I'd feel like 294 00:18:37.270 --> 00:18:41.026 the coach wouldn't necessarily be listening to the client, they would just be 295 00:18:41.048 --> 00:18:44.098 using the questions that they know and the 296 00:18:44.264 --> 00:18:48.022 conversation wouldn't be bespoke at all. Okay. 297 00:18:48.076 --> 00:18:51.046 So you'd be looking to try and find out why they wanted to feel they 298 00:18:51.068 --> 00:18:54.726 needed to change, what was their why, 299 00:18:54.908 --> 00:18:58.486 what's going wrong, and let them unlock that themselves 300 00:18:58.588 --> 00:19:02.106 as to whatever comes out of why they want to change or why they think 301 00:19:02.128 --> 00:19:05.754 they need help. So in coaching, we often talk about what's called 302 00:19:05.792 --> 00:19:09.622 limiting beliefs. And these beliefs 303 00:19:09.686 --> 00:19:13.454 are, let's say, barriers or stumbling blocks that might 304 00:19:13.492 --> 00:19:17.294 stop you from getting to where you want to go. And so we 305 00:19:17.332 --> 00:19:20.878 would work together in kind of unpacking that and seeing 306 00:19:20.964 --> 00:19:24.674 how that is affecting them now and what 307 00:19:24.712 --> 00:19:28.258 ways they can kind of work on that or try and 308 00:19:28.344 --> 00:19:32.114 go around it to be able to get to their goal. Right, 309 00:19:32.152 --> 00:19:35.694 I got you. Okay. I've had some pretty limiting 310 00:19:35.742 --> 00:19:39.506 beliefs in my own life over the years, and I've 311 00:19:39.538 --> 00:19:43.366 broken through a few of them, but they're still there. I think it's a 312 00:19:43.388 --> 00:19:46.520 human thing. We all wish to be 313 00:19:47.210 --> 00:19:50.966 accepted for who we are, embrace who we are. And sometimes we're 314 00:19:50.998 --> 00:19:54.246 too worried or get very nervous about pushing ourselves into our stretch 315 00:19:54.278 --> 00:19:57.754 zone or into our panic zone without really 316 00:19:57.872 --> 00:20:01.514 we like to be safe, don't we? And sometimes the limiting beliefs is that we 317 00:20:01.632 --> 00:20:05.386 need to be safe, need to feel that we've got respect for 318 00:20:05.408 --> 00:20:08.990 people around us. And by going to our stretch, we sometimes feel, well, maybe 319 00:20:09.060 --> 00:20:11.806 what's, some of them judge us at this point. What if I'm not quite good 320 00:20:11.828 --> 00:20:15.186 enough? What if I can't succeed? So, yeah, I completely get that. 321 00:20:15.208 --> 00:20:18.946 And as I said, I had to 322 00:20:18.968 --> 00:20:22.654 overcome a few of those challenges myself. Exactly. Limiting 323 00:20:22.702 --> 00:20:25.940 beliefs are just part of being human and it makes us who we are. 324 00:20:26.950 --> 00:20:30.726 And so I'm not saying that we would want to be in 325 00:20:30.748 --> 00:20:34.406 a situation where we don't have any limiting beliefs at all, because that would make 326 00:20:34.428 --> 00:20:38.246 us not human. But what I'm saying is that there are ways to be able 327 00:20:38.268 --> 00:20:41.754 to overcome them, to be able to reach the challenge that 328 00:20:41.792 --> 00:20:44.570 you reach the goal that you want to achieve. 329 00:20:45.630 --> 00:20:48.220 One thing that I realised when I was 330 00:20:49.310 --> 00:20:52.826 feeling this intense impostor syndrome, which I guess is 331 00:20:52.848 --> 00:20:56.686 another side of limiting beliefs, where you just feel you're not good enough, 332 00:20:56.708 --> 00:20:59.646 you got to be discovered, it's all part of feeling that same sort of part 333 00:20:59.668 --> 00:21:02.974 of your psyche. What I suddenly realised was I was 334 00:21:03.012 --> 00:21:05.360 benchmarking myself against myself, 335 00:21:06.290 --> 00:21:10.034 so I could never escape my shadow. So no matter how 336 00:21:10.072 --> 00:21:13.826 much I improved, I always saw my shadow with me. And therefore that was 337 00:21:13.848 --> 00:21:17.540 my reference point. So I never felt I was achieving anything. So 338 00:21:18.550 --> 00:21:21.286 one of the things I learned was to be able to anchor a moment in 339 00:21:21.308 --> 00:21:24.918 time where I could see the difference between me today 340 00:21:25.004 --> 00:21:28.806 and me then, and not judge myself about how I was 341 00:21:28.828 --> 00:21:32.474 yesterday, but how I was three months ago. And then learn to listen to 342 00:21:32.512 --> 00:21:35.962 people who said, that's good, that's fantastic, well done, really 343 00:21:36.016 --> 00:21:39.674 appreciate that. And take that as a compliment and lock it in and say, 344 00:21:39.712 --> 00:21:43.014 okay, I did a good job. I'm not going to beat myself up or double 345 00:21:43.062 --> 00:21:46.782 think that or go, no, you're only kidding, I don't believe you type 346 00:21:46.836 --> 00:21:49.774 thing, which is often. We do that as well, don't we? So I've learned to 347 00:21:49.812 --> 00:21:53.610 accept praise, recognition, feedback and positively. 348 00:21:53.690 --> 00:21:57.538 And I've also learned to anchor points in 349 00:21:57.544 --> 00:22:01.298 my life so I can go back and benchmark myself against an anchor point. I 350 00:22:01.304 --> 00:22:05.154 think that really helped me in those terms. That sounds 351 00:22:05.192 --> 00:22:08.854 like a fantastic breakthrough to me. But we must 352 00:22:08.892 --> 00:22:12.534 be conscious that a lot of people won't know how to kind of 353 00:22:12.572 --> 00:22:16.262 break that down in their head completely. Yeah, completely. And so 354 00:22:16.316 --> 00:22:20.106 working with a coach, it might help them kind of see that perspective and 355 00:22:20.128 --> 00:22:23.850 get to the breakthrough that you've obviously achieved. Yeah, 356 00:22:23.920 --> 00:22:27.546 I think mine was hyper amplified by the fact I work 357 00:22:27.568 --> 00:22:31.322 alone a lot and I do lots of short term gig type 358 00:22:31.376 --> 00:22:35.006 work. So I'm always doing something new. I'm always meeting new 359 00:22:35.028 --> 00:22:38.590 people. I'm always doing another talk or another training session for different people. 360 00:22:38.740 --> 00:22:42.574 So therefore it's always hard to have any comparison between two 361 00:22:42.612 --> 00:22:46.418 days or two weeks. So I guess if you're more closely aligned with the 362 00:22:46.424 --> 00:22:50.034 team, it may be easier to benchmark yourself. But when you are 363 00:22:50.072 --> 00:22:53.506 literally a loner, sometimes that's the hard 364 00:22:53.528 --> 00:22:57.266 thing. And I guess going back to the AAA theme 365 00:22:57.298 --> 00:23:01.110 or the supercharging is that getting 366 00:23:01.180 --> 00:23:04.838 to that breakthrough moment would be much quicker with a 367 00:23:04.844 --> 00:23:08.346 coach. So a lot of people just don't have the 368 00:23:08.368 --> 00:23:12.074 time to do that. And so it's important to kind 369 00:23:12.112 --> 00:23:15.642 of supercharge it and get to that step 370 00:23:15.696 --> 00:23:19.546 quicker in many cases. So it's recognising. Your 371 00:23:19.568 --> 00:23:22.586 batteries are starting to get depleted of power 372 00:23:22.768 --> 00:23:26.586 and learning. You've got to take them out of the back of the bunny 373 00:23:26.618 --> 00:23:30.398 and put them on charge overnight or use the coach to be 374 00:23:30.404 --> 00:23:34.126 able to top up your charge again. That's kind of what you're saying, make time 375 00:23:34.148 --> 00:23:37.986 for yourself. Well, I wouldn't want to say that the batteries are 376 00:23:38.008 --> 00:23:41.490 depleted because that just doesn't sound very friendly to my clients. 377 00:23:43.270 --> 00:23:47.038 But what I would say is that recognising that 378 00:23:47.064 --> 00:23:50.646 you're in a situation where you don't know how to get to the next step 379 00:23:50.748 --> 00:23:54.518 and allowing yourself that time with someone who's there to support 380 00:23:54.604 --> 00:23:58.454 you and kind of gifting that time 381 00:23:58.492 --> 00:24:02.102 to yourself. Yeah. Okay. So literally 382 00:24:02.166 --> 00:24:05.898 carving out a space in your schedule and say, this is me time, this 383 00:24:05.904 --> 00:24:09.514 is investment time, this is to help me move 384 00:24:09.552 --> 00:24:13.354 past my block time. So almost like a reward for giving that time up 385 00:24:13.392 --> 00:24:16.926 is that you make progress, you develop yourself. I mean, a lot of my 386 00:24:16.948 --> 00:24:20.400 clients aren't used to setting aside time just for themselves 387 00:24:21.250 --> 00:24:24.946 in the same way that they might have never been listened to. They're not 388 00:24:24.968 --> 00:24:28.482 used to investing in themselves. And so 389 00:24:28.536 --> 00:24:32.146 just giving themselves an hour, that's an hour of 390 00:24:32.168 --> 00:24:35.734 just them talking about themselves can be quite 391 00:24:35.772 --> 00:24:37.240 cathartic in that sense. 392 00:24:40.170 --> 00:24:43.462 What other stuff have you done in your life? I mean, you've obviously done 393 00:24:43.516 --> 00:24:47.218 this with people at end of life, 394 00:24:47.404 --> 00:24:51.034 you've become a coach. What else have you 395 00:24:51.072 --> 00:24:54.714 done? You're obviously worldly and 396 00:24:54.752 --> 00:24:58.474 wise. With my 397 00:24:58.512 --> 00:25:02.154 coaching, I'm currently working on a workshop called Thriving 398 00:25:02.202 --> 00:25:05.946 amid Change Challenge and Uncertainty that I'm hoping 399 00:25:05.978 --> 00:25:09.550 to help people during the coronavirus time. Also, 400 00:25:09.620 --> 00:25:12.986 I'm developing my own podcast called Your Hero Is 401 00:25:13.028 --> 00:25:16.706