Joanne Lockwood: Hello everyone my name is Joanne Lockwood and I'm your host for the inclusion Bites podcast in this series I have interviewed a number of amazing people and simply had a conversation about the subject of inclusion belonging. And generally making the world a better place for everyone to thrive if you like to join me in the future then please do drop me line to Jo Dot Lockwood has t change happen dot code ukass wly change happen dot co u k you can catch up with all of the previous shows on Itunes. Spotify and the usual places to plug in the headphones grab a caf and let's get going today is episode 72 with the title leaving no stone unturned. And I have the absolute honor and privilege to welcome Arno simple Arlo describes himself as a tapperwa which means eternal rebirth and when I ask arno to describe his superpower. He said leading harmony into people's lives hello ano welcome to the show.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Hello Hello Joan thank you so much for having me on the show. It's an honor as well.
Joanne Lockwood: Ah, is a pleasure. So Ano we're just talking in the green room before we came live about leaving no stone unturned What does that mean to you.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, well, it's a very good question and a very good title. The I guess probably that this method that I created for the past thirty years is really about leaving no stone unturned. In other words helping me understand how I am having or how I is having this human experience and understanding how this life of ours is articulated and works. What's what's the framework within which. It it functions way is it that I am going through patterns again and again and again throughout my life situations repeating themselves. Why is it that I feel sometimes limited sometimes I feel free. Why is it that sometimes I may feel sad and other moments happy. And what if there could be ah, a global understanding a framework that enables me to make sense of all of that and you know that has been my whole life to turn all the stones. As as many as I can so that that whole thing that we call life starts to make sense to me and then I can share it with other people does that? yes.
Joanne Lockwood: So you've been working. Yeah, you've been working on us for 38 years you say um I think that's incredible I've I guess I'm I just do light I haven't I haven't actually sat there and analyzed as you say the the repeating pattern. Who say of happiness sadness financial wealth financial challenges. Um, we come in cycles through our lives and recently topoint and as you I think you were saying basically a rollercoaster of emotions and experiences and challenges.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Through being.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, isn't it this.
Joanne Lockwood: And I'd never I'd never thought of that I just thought it was kind of like inevitable that when things are going Well you can have a bump but why.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Not necessarily and to expand on what you just said? Yes, it is about your experience but it's also about the patterns of the actual events and situations and conversation you have they tend also to repeat themselves across time. Until the moment you start to make conscious choices that free you from from that Pattern. So It's understanding these keys on how life is talking to me and how I can and unwind the ah.
Arnaud Saint Paul: The reason why these patterns exist. So yeah, why do we tend to insist in living them that is very puzzling to me now because there's a way.
Joanne Lockwood: So how how much of these cycles are within your control are we living in a world where politics climate ah seasons of the year all have an impact on. Our experiences or are you thinking that a lot of these things are are actually within our control and how we react to how we deal with them allow us to take take power back if you like.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Right? Well yes, there are these cycles and then there are the cycles of you know the more individual cycles or for a company cycle as well for teams as well. So cycles from an individual standpoint. It can be. Just the passage of age right? The 20 years of the twenty the thirty years old and so on or the cycle of having kids and then not having kids ah the cycle of going through the forty years old crisis right.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Just to take these examples are so many and they are all overlapping. Ah one another. So all these cycles The ones you you described and the ones I was just listing out there. We all have control about them on them.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Yeah, so let me refine what control is what I mean by that is now. Obviously you cannot control what is happening in the us right now and the the political situation or the war in Ukraine and whatnot. No obviously not. The same way that you cannot control the discussion with the bus or with your partner. Whatever no way what you do control though is the fact that you can at any moment in time forego this habit of. Ah, being on a toppilot meaning instead of reacting to any situation events conversation thought emotion you can make a pause and make a choice from that place. So in other words, you have taken the time and the space within you to reposition yourself and find the foundation from which you can declare in truth to yourself in that moment. This is what I choose. And that makes a whole world of difference and we can apply that to everything. There's no reason why not and that's an amazing freedom that we all have but we you know most of us do not act upon it. Funny enough.
Joanne Lockwood: And yeah as you're talking now I'm thinking about an incident in my life where I had this I had this same realization that if I if I didn't change so anything my life would continue as it was.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, yes.
Joanne Lockwood: And I'm not saying my life was unhappy or it needed to change specifically for many reasons but there was 1 thing in my life that did need to change and I think that the the momentum you have in your life sometimes stops you from. Making decisions because you have thesponsibilities you say children house mortgage family expectations status um all these kind of things in your life money. Income. Um, and there's this fear of disrupting that continuum. Um.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, no.
Joanne Lockwood: Making a radical change and I and I think as you say we we get into our 40 s and we we sometimes look over our shoulder and go well I've come a long way but I'm not sure I want to keep going in this direction to the midlife crisis. The re-evaluation of our relationships. The children may be leaving home. Our maturity of.
Arnaud Saint Paul: I.
Joanne Lockwood: Ah, we our politicalistic kill a leions sometimes changes and what what matters to us changes but still where we can can be apprehensive and I describe it as whaing the stop button and ah if you've ever flown from gatwick airport in London.
Arnaud Saint Paul: This is.
Joanne Lockwood: But this is massive great being long travelators and you get on it the get the taxi drops you off and you get on this travelator and it goes on for about one hundred yards and you have to get off get on another one get off get on another one and the metaphor I use is I was I was going to Malaga on holiday and I got to bet the end of the second travel later and I thought I don't want to go to Malaggoan holiday. Want to go somewhere else. That's press that stop button get all my luggage off off this conveyor belt and just put it on the side and stop and have a think what do I really want to do with my life and some might say that I made a radical choice I gender transition to that point.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Are the.
Joanne Lockwood: Which was a complete reorientation of my entire being and everybody around me. But then I got back on that convey about having redefined who I was and then now when now I get it now I'm happy and I can now take this kind of helicopter view of my life and realize I can. Make decisions and not to be guided by what I'm expected to do without any control. So What you're saying that really resonates with my own lived experience and how I say things.
Arnaud Saint Paul: and and I'm going I'm going to dive deeper on that what you just mentioned and thank you for sharing is actually there's an underlying fear related to making a ah conscious choice which is to redefining my own identity. Because the moment I am starting to make a conscious choice I am asking myself is it that I am really that now or do I want to be something else someone else or you know, just. Be ah, maybe more open and and positive about life or whatever and then so I start sit for a second with who is it that I want to be and then make a step take a step towards whatever it is and then explore discover what is there to be found.
Joanne Lockwood: A.
Arnaud Saint Paul: About myself. So that's probably the most scary aspect and and to take that responsibility of me being me and letting go of the blaming the being the victim ah of etc etc. So.
Arnaud Saint Paul: That's why so it is so difficult for so many to take that journey and that journey affects Absolutely everything and in your story you really demonstrated beautifully I mean to change your whole identity is amazing. Ah, but it actually implies so many aspects of your life including the series of events that are happening Beyond Beyond whichever small or big Choice. You're making and by making a conscious choice. We actually embark. On an ascendy ascending journey towards myself instead of a constraining one and that's you know when we're not to pilot. It's that the energy pool is so strong that I by default I am here to continue that journey as you were saying earlier. But it is also restraining itself Gradually, you know it's losing entropy and ah when you do make a conscious choice then all of a sudden you give yourself more power more freedom and you can really expand and explore.
Joanne Lockwood: So.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Other signs of yourself and I believe this is the most beautiful gift that one can give to oneself.
Joanne Lockwood: I Think it is it giving yourself permission to decide not who you want to be I wouldn't say deciding who you want to be but who you really are inside and there's that misalignment between your core values your core identity.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Indeed.
Joanne Lockwood: The expectations that people have of you and your your part you play in the world and the path that you always felt you should be on because yeah I don't know about you but I I grew up as ah with my parents guiding me. Maybe in their image or their suggestions about what I should be doing in life and sometimes you find yourself falling into something that isn't your passion. It just is available. It's there there suddenly you meet somebody and you don't necessarily choose them. It just becomes love or becomes marriage. Children start that So all these things kind of are these micro decisions that have a huge impact later in life that you didn't realize you were making a decision at the time. It just felt easy and natural I think there's only many when you look back and say and I I will never say I'm unhappy I was never unhappy. I was never had a bad life.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, listen.
Joanne Lockwood: I I am the product of my previous experiences and I always value my children my my relationships and the life I've had it just got to a point where that life had become past its cell by date. It was that moldy sandwich at the back of a fridge.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Are.
Joanne Lockwood: Say Well actually we need to throw that not well I say throw it away I didn't want to throw it away I want what I wanted to do was just maybe repackage it slightly and and just give it a ah bit more fresh lettuce or something like that. Ah, and yeah, it's what you're saying is really powerful because so many people.
Arnaud Saint Paul: And and.
Joanne Lockwood: Tell me I was brave and I wasn't brave I was just honest with myself but the bravery comes when you when you you realize the impact you have on those around you and the risk of failure or the risk of it being really really tough.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Listen.
Joanne Lockwood: Um, because we're all scared of that that failure we're scared that humiliation. We're scared of of of disrupting what people think of us and that that's the challenge isn't it. Yeah.
Arnaud Saint Paul: So yeah, as you said earlier these contract choices are all about deeply connecting with my own essence and being able to be as true as possible in total transparency towards myself of Whatever it is that I I want to be in the world and so the the I I'm talking about here has probably a broader definition. It's not just the eye that is the role like I am the parent of or I am of this gender etc. But Ai that encompasses the whole world and sees itself across every single aspect of it meaning that every single experience and situation. You're living and again I'm talking about very simple things talking with the the bakery guy or. Or having a discussion with a partner are always ah like a mirror. It brings me back an image of me whether there is judgment in front on the other side or not doesn't really matter. But this is how I perceive myself in this moment. And how I can see what it is that I want to be in that moment because of that situation so each moment in essence is independent from all the other moments we do choose to.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Believe and be identified to past stories and roles that we like to continue on like you know like having a suit and and a jacket and a coat and etc. We have quite a bunch of them and we can. Gradually let go of them if we choose To. That's the whole idea of being in Harmony and coherence and alignment with where ourselves where we become at some point that kind of tuning fork that really expresses the purest vibration of who you are. In the world and for the world and being really the vehicle of expression of life as it is in its purest and rawest aspect and when that happens we are completely free.
Joanne Lockwood: You know.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Of anything that was constraining us and maybe we're walking in the nude because we don't have any but coat and and the jacket went now figuratively Obviously Ah, but in the end you can wear any garment from now on because.
Joanne Lockwood: And.
Arnaud Saint Paul: You are the purest expression of who you can be and and and life is there to bring us to that as much as we allow it life is talking to us every day. That's the the core of my of my method to help us understand how that works and how. Life is talking with to me and then how I can let go of this code and that code and that code and see in the real world. How this unfolds and grows hence the name tappu at the eternal know rebirth because we are. In that process the moment we do a conscious Choice. We are in a rebirth Maybe a small one but still, it's one that can compound itself I don't know if you know the term Maybe I'm going to explain it compounding in finance terms is you put.
Joanne Lockwood: Oh yes, yes.
Arnaud Saint Paul: 2% every month on a placement and then all of a sudden it makes a huge amount after 10 years or whatever exactly exactly so here you have the same thing every little conscious choice.
Joanne Lockwood: Yeah, says the interest on the interests on the interests. Everything it exponentially grows. Yeah.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Has a compounding effect in the long term and we have that in our hands. It's our magic. Everyone has that magic in themselves. Let's start doing it.
Joanne Lockwood: So it's It's not a mindset that many people have or or know they have I mean it. It takes a I would say a lot of self awareness self-actualization. It's almost like an ascension to a net to another plane.
Arnaud Saint Paul: No.
Joanne Lockwood: To step out of your your jacket into the nude if you like and say what what feels comfortable with how do we? Well how do you work with people to to help them on that that plane of evolution if you like.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Well, the that's why and you know in the past thirty years came together a series of drawings and charts that helped me understand that whole thing and to make sense of it and and about ten years ago I started discovering talking with people about my little charts and they started oh. That's interesting, etc and then I started to to help leaders and individuals in general to understand themselves like it's like a ah visual map. Of what it is to be I in this world and have this whole articulation. Not only of ah the other I self but also the polarities the masque in the feminine all that how does it articulate how does that help me in my day-to-day. So that I can feel better and feel more enjoy at peace incoherence with myself and the world and so came together in the end, a ninety day. So it's actually 9 sessions and we go through the charts and I explain them and it starts to. Click and in parallel to that we learn how to using what happens and unfold in one's life like if we could take your past week and figure out the different events that happened like the 2 or 3 events that happened during the week and then they all have.
Arnaud Saint Paul: An interconnection. They are all the ah the the top of the wave that we can seal or the iceberg if you wish and there is 1 underlying belief system that is connecting all of them and we we and unlock that fi belief system and poof. All of us and you're free from it and we repeat that reads and repeat every week and and you learn how to do it yourself basically and that's how it works and it works amazingly for the people that are practicing it I mean there's no because again, we're just. In a dance with our own life and having that and new understanding indeed as you are saying we're getting doing it from a new octave standpoint so to speak a new vibrational standpoint and it happens it happens obviously at first it starts. A little bit more difficult and then gradually it starts to go faster and faster and easier and easier.
Joanne Lockwood: Much of our society our business. Our family. In fact most of the structure most people live in day-to-day relies on some level of stability some level of conformity some level of um process or or a follows. But b follows a follows c and d and is society ready for everybody to kind of self-actualize to to find themselves to to think in in a different plane of existence or a plane of a being. Our society at the moment relies on people having control and momentum and responsibility and what we're saying here is I find people people react to me a bit because I'm going hang on a minute you you stepped out of your your role in your mold. Ah, how do we process that. And so 99.9 percent of the population are still living close lives. They haven't found their tappo at every birth yet. How would it work if everybody finds themselves but all be wandering around free thinking is society going to work.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Yeah, it's a fascinating question I believe so I believe Humanity is ready. Definitely I see so many trends that are pointing in the same direction in the past in the past.
Joanne Lockwood: As it is.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Hundred years as well as in the past ten or twenty years and so let's look at a few of them ah from a well from a societal standpoint right? The the birth of or the recognition. More importantly.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Of first women and then ah the the multisexual movement and I don't know what is the exact term but and the the algbtq and so on and so forth. Um, the.
Arnaud Saint Paul: The birth of old that is related to in the finance world social impact investment environmental investment etc. The communication. Unique educational world around the sustainable development goals of the un which is twenty years old not much more than that. Um, in technology. We're seeing first the birth of the internet which is an interconnection of every single soul on on the planet which is a very much a a copy of what consciousness is about and now we're seeing the. Not only are we going to space soon. But more importantly, we we are getting onto a new revolution which is the revolution of conum computing which is going from a framework of particles one and zeros that are. Independent 1 from another to overlapping vibrations that collapses when there is an observer so that we are many many facets of our society and there are many more are really showing the same thing that humanity even if it takes it took it. Took humanity 100 years at the mass market level to start to have a glimpse of what quantum physics shows and it's still moving in that direction and covid has been an amazing example of that too.
Arnaud Saint Paul: In more of the negative way, but it actually has a positive impact and and and so we are ready Clearly, it's still. There is a long way to go obviously for the next decades.
Joanne Lockwood: And.
Arnaud Saint Paul: But even a project like the the other project I'm working on is called give nation is a platform for children to become philanthropists and practice sustainable financial literacy which is there to create a positive relationship with money and help kids to learn. How to have empathy and compassion and altruism on a day to day but from a kid from 5 years old onwards. So we we are there to create huge movements and I believe this is happening as we speak of transforming our reality. In something that becomes more and more coherent with our heart and less and less with the mind construct of controlling in power etc.
Joanne Lockwood: So do you think there's a generational shift. Um, so we look at Gen Z Gen Alpha they're far more far more connected digitally. There's a lot more stresses but they're also far more in touch with their own sense of self so in sense of identity and those around them.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, yes.
Joanne Lockwood: And building relationships strong relationships with their peer group is important to them whereas maybe Boomers and Gen X as millennials didn't have haven't had the same relationship in that way whereas in the future they're expecting people to be connected. They expect people to to build a. And also living in um, in in this ever evolving metaverse this this digital footprint that we will will exist in and is this is this all helping or is this is this going to complicate your your message. Yeah.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Now on the contrary. Yes, there are these generation shifts as well. And thank you for bringing them I forgot them and but in parallel in these same generations are kids that have a. Would I put it a higher access to Consciousness. It's It's not the right way to say it. But let's say that they have a a higher understanding than there The the previous generation for sure I see so many examples and the fact that they are more and more interconnected. Is actually a great benefit in the sense that it allows us to really spread out quick. Um, long-term changes as long as we do it in the right way Obviously and um and plus. You know this world of hours that we're creating now is a world of visual where emotions are going to become vehicles further of of transformation actually and we see with Ar and with the the multiverses and so on that these are possibility to create movements. That are um, really making these changes happen. So but obviously any system has always their pros and cons and you know its its Polarities. We're in a world of contrast. So We need both. But um, both are true and both are valid.
Joanne Lockwood: Is.
Arnaud Saint Paul: The question is what is the conscious choice. We want to make ah related to each right.
Joanne Lockwood: Yeah, and you have the power to make that conscious choice that that to yeah, give yourself permission or recognizing you have inherently permission to make those choices. Um, and.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Everybody has everybody has.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Even if there are small ones don't have to be you know, changing the whole world. Just little change is good.
Joanne Lockwood: And so.
Joanne Lockwood: Yeah, we can all decide how we're going to react to a situation to a statement to somebody else's reaction to us. We all have that micro power to say actually not not now I'll smile this time I can smile back I can I could be positive back and so often with a aware. But so blinker. We're so living in our moment in our stress in our momentum that we don't mean those little choices we have we we can stop and go as you I think you said at the beginning be at a pause and and say yeah.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Yes, we we all have a pause button. We all have it.
Joanne Lockwood: I've got 2 paths which one do I want to take and it doesn't matter as long as you long as you you can always? You can always go down path one and say actually this is the wrong one I need to go the other way and and go back and go forwards somehow we always want to keep go forwards. Don't we.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Yes, completely I remember now part of your other question prior that was very interesting as well. So sorry I'm rewinding it a bit you are saying if I understood correctly in this society where we're coming from where everything is about.
Joanne Lockwood: Yeah.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Control and takinging taking responsibility having responsible people and so on how is it that we can get onto a place where everything is changing and so there are 2 things that are quite interesting. So yes, you see a lot of people that are. You know, being responsible and being whether the right Ceo or the right accountant or whatever funny enough from our angle. Not a lot of people are actually taking that whole responsibility of themselves under their reality. So. There's a little contrast there that is quite interesting. And so what if we can all choose at the very least to take responsibility of ourselves to start with and then from their trust that whatever may come and however society may evolve will be the right 1 right? and.
Joanne Lockwood: And.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, now to the second part of your question I truly believe that life is way far far. It's way more intelligent and I trust much much more life than. Limited scope of the mind. What I mean by that is ah life is always looking to bring about a solution or a question Mark and I have the the. Opportunity to choose if I want to answer it or and or not etc. As we said earlier and when the the flow of life is actually piloting all these individuals that have gone through the process. We just mentioned of of conscious choices. Then. Life can continue its job to bring about the best in all these people at the same time. So in other words, we're talking about people that are making conscious choices are trusting their lives and therefore others. With all that they need to trust for that's I believe a better society that is driven by love and feels supported and at peace with itself and therefore is in tune with its own joy with.
Joanne Lockwood: I Think yeah, it's It's a great vision that you're painting here and I completely buy into it and but I do wonder if it's opportunity of this nature is restricted almost by privilege when you're.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Okay.
Joanne Lockwood: You lack privilege you're worried about Today. You're worried about now your next meal your your roof your your your safety. Um and when you have privilege you have stability in your life. You have a roof income Love family Then. You have the ability to self-actualize you have the ability to think creatively is it a.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Actually and I would defer on that the very core of this framework and this understanding of life is one that is can only function and work in the now Moment. So because the thing is what we call Stability is a core need of identifying with past stories that and ah reinforce my sense of identity ah identification with expectations of the future. I'm going to receive my my sirary or whatever in the future. It's going to come my way, etc, etc. And therefore there is basically nobody in the middle. It's all spread out. My energy is all spread out between these things and. I Have a lot of difficulties to actually let go of all these beautiful shiny things that I have around me to really pinpoint to being here now in this moment to the true self that I am. When you are in survival mode as you as you were saying earlier I don't have a choice right? There's no choice I have nothing to lose in the past nothing to lose in the Future. So nothing to expect in the Future. So and I am actually.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Have to live now. So what if I can help you give you some keys to shift. Whatever is there yet to be lost from a self-identities standpoint and then help you allow life to bring you to a new place.
Joanne Lockwood: I I completely. Ah concur I agree with you and as you were talking now I was thinking that the more privilege you have the more investment you have in the status quo the less likely you are to change because. What you have and momentum you have you want to protect because because of your privilege or whatever you have so in some respects you're less likely to want to change if your life appears to be satisfying and good as you and I agree agree again and when you say the less you have the more you live in the moment.
Arnaud Saint Paul: The.
Joanne Lockwood: More those changes are ah positive and you have direct impact on your next on your next activity by by having a choice whether you eat that don't eat that sleep peer don't sleep there and you are making living in the moment inherently and and what you're saying here is is coming into ah a way of thinking where you are. Comfortable living in the moment and making these micro choices of positivity or decisions rather than just letting the momentum just take you down the stream without you having any say.
Arnaud Saint Paul: I do see also people that are affluent and have all this and really are diving deeper into being the the their real self so to speak but they they are already in.
Joanne Lockwood: Um.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Ah, growth Mindset they are already wanting to step up their game. So it's a different ballpark but most of us will always privilege focusing on what they know ready instead of wanting to dabble into.
Joanne Lockwood: And.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Other aspects that they don't control so to speak and and it's okay, right? It's just you know as long as you want to continue not to pilot your life. That's great. You know that's why life is there for that. So not a problem What if you may.
Joanne Lockwood: And.
Arnaud Saint Paul: One day make a first step for yourself and and really start exploring in a very small way or in a big one whichever doesn't matter what it looks like to be you but from another angle.
Joanne Lockwood: Yeah I just have reflection at the beginning of the year I mean la you'll do new year new ideas. New new resolutions forever. Um I think it it was the wakeup call I needed to think about my life I'm I'm currently 57 years old and I thought. Where where do I want to be when I I picked I picked the ages 75 as a number and I thought to myself. Well at the age of 75 I want to be able to do have the freedom to do what I want to do so health. Um, physical.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Are.
Joanne Lockwood: Um, fitness to whatever extent that means mental acuity. Um enough. Ah ah of a wealth or resources to be able to make choice and have freedom of choice and it certainly occurred to me that if I wasn't careful I may not make it. Because it's not guaranteed for anybody and if I did my fitness levels and my being significant overweight very lethargic not doing any activity meant that my my body um may not be able to carry my my Desired. Um.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Where.
Arnaud Saint Paul: The.
Joanne Lockwood: Strategy about being able to be active. So I made a conscious decision to eat healthier. Ah stop drinking I haven't had drink and I haven't drunkank alcohol for three hundred days now this year I urged the gym go swimming I bought a bike a e bike. So I'm out peddling and going around the local town.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Revo.
Joanne Lockwood: Because I realized I couldn't wait till I was 67 to to to see my path to 75 I back scheduled and thought the time is today every day I I I ignore it today is one is is a bit um um, less fit at 75 so I had to make that decision now and.
Arnaud Saint Paul: He.
Joanne Lockwood: I'm not perfect. I'm not I haven't lost the weight I hope to lose but I so I go to the gym every twice a week I have a personal trainer I cycle when I can and and do things so whilst I'm no nowhere near on the on the curve that I wanted to be I'm certainly a long way from where I was when I started in certainly an attitude and. I'm always thinking about it I I give an example when I joined the gym I kind of I kind of said to myself I don't think about it's costing me £50 per month. What I think of is if I choose to sit on the sofa and not go to the gym. I'm paying sofa tax I'm paying £50 per month to sit on the sofa. So I've reframed it so every time I go to the gym an hour on the sofa costs less so rather than the gym cotonness is so I can make positive choices with my life I park I park further away.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, this this this is.
Joanne Lockwood: So I walk further to something I don't try and take the easy option if I'm if I've got to catch the train I make sure I park farther away for the train station I will try and walk not get the not get the tube or not get the bus if I can I try and take the stairs not the escalate. So I'm making these little choices towards my big goal.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, and.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, miss.
Joanne Lockwood: Being able to enjoy life at 75 and that's that was my this year's stop button if you like that I need to make these positive choices.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Amazing and it happens that you are now the amazing fit person you are going to be at 75 so you don't need even to wait to be 75 because you are now living it already.
Joanne Lockwood: And yeah I I said I said to my my my my physical training instructor well on my first induction list. She said to me what's your goal of doing this and I said I gave the same story about being at 75 and I said I want to be able to go on a cycle ride.
Arnaud Saint Paul: And in shock there was no reason for them.
Joanne Lockwood: And come back going. Wow I really enjoyed that that it wasn't it wasn't a stress a struggle I want to better walk up a hill near where I live get to the top and go wow what of you and come back home and go I really enjoyed that I can do that today by come back and go I'm really tired I'm really ah I enjoyed it by I'm absolutely drained. So I just want to make that feeling of exhaustion decrease. That's what I'm looking for. So I come back I could do it again. Let's do it again now and and it's that's that's the kind of the micro change of the the impact it's going to have my life is is be able to do the things I enjoy and and feel that I could.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, and.
Joanne Lockwood: Keep doing them all the time I don't feel I have to sort of Persuade myself that I should do it really I'm doing it because I love it and I enjoy it and I know the feeling I'm going to get at the end of it So That's kind of the the way I framed in my head about why I want to do this and so the why is clear. I Know why I'm doing it I know exactly what? what I'm trying to achieve and ah listen to what you're saying is you can make those decisions about other aspects of the life. Whatever that may be.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, any aspect. Absolutely any aspect indeed. Beautiful example. Thank you for sharing.
Joanne Lockwood: Yeah I I often get people asking me about oh you So you stop drinking. It's like it's almost like there's that like they haven't so it's almost like they don't trust you anymore. Why Why did you stop drinking Why it's like they they want this big preaching thing I said well.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um.
Joanne Lockwood: My choice is I don't want to have a drink today. It just so happens. There's been three hundred days when I decided not to have a drink and tomorrow I'll make the same decision I will never drink I've got an app on my phone every day I wake up and I go not drunk yesterday not drunk yesterday and I got I track it and I've got to the point now where.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Are.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, this is.
Joanne Lockwood: I think I passed three hundred days last week I thought if I have a drink today. That's 300 resets I've now got an investment in the momentum I've got a new momentum and a new way of thinking I'm now invested in that as a life choice and to have a drink means that i've.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, then the.
Joanne Lockwood: Negated all that I've done so far and I can see what I lose and I and I and because I want to hit 400 I Want to hit 500 I Want to hit a thousand and I don't want have to start again. So It's kind of I've created mini benchmarks in my life. Um. I Measure my waist I measure my thighs I measure all the inches I measure my weight but I'm I'm not focusing on that at the Moment. So I'm thinking about So I've got data to back up my my plan because I do like a bit of data sometimes but it it allows me to see where I'm coming and going and so whilst it's it's. A bit more cerebral misness Maybe than maybe the free thinking because I have still got rules in there but it's allowing me to sort of visualize and realize what what want I've achieve so and I think we all can do this. You know we we if we don't do something. We'll keep doing what we've always done and I think we've got to.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Are.
Joanne Lockwood: Decide What's important in our lives in our work in our family. Whatever it may be and not just accept that our trajectory is is fixed in stone.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Are.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Yeah, and actually ah and another example came to to my mind working with the Ceo so you know the place where we all measure everything are companies right and businesses and and so. How does a conscious choice beyond the the examples you just gave how does a conscious choice actually make a difference from a business standpoint and ah so again that that example of a Ceo that I was working with for the past three years and so every week we meet and we decipher these events that are important and understand what is unfolding in that week and the problem the the company had was that they were pre-revenue it had. Was like three months that they were not able to actually make it happen and they had on the table. Ah 8 figure contracts. It's in finance and they were not able to carry it out. No way for whatever reason like always there was an incident of this and that. And and so that week there were a series of events pointing to the relationship between the Ceo and his company company being you know an entity itself like you and i.
Arnaud Saint Paul: You know a company is a consciousness right? or or spirit at the very least and and so that relationship between the founder and that that consciousness of the company was a little bit skewed in the sense that. The Ceo wanted to control everything right? as we usually do most of the time and in that case it was a fear of the feminine that goes into chaotic mode once in a while and you know blows up everything and and then she's after a while a little bit more tranquil. And and so hence the need for the maskquey to say you know I control everything etc. Yes, however, the company also needs to blossom right? If you don't free her. For her to be able to grow on its own then there is no chance this actually can grow and that's what was actually unfolding because anything that is yeah, anything that is in your reality right is of the feminine principle. That's why I was equating that.
Joanne Lockwood: Um.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Of the company and as a feminine in this case and so we unlocked that so we went through you know, letting go of that belief of I need to control the chaos of of the the feminine polarity or energy and the next week they signed a nine figure contract. And and off they go and they were on revenue and now they they are super prosperous. Um, so but it's a conscious choice and a need to be made to let go of 1 aspect that was part of the identity of that individual and so that you could experience. A new aspect of him and in this case his company so that they can both be happy together I guess ah, but more importantly, explore new challenges or or new aspects.
Joanne Lockwood: And.
Arnaud Saint Paul: That will help them to to grow further does that make sense if helpful.
Joanne Lockwood: It does because ah I was thinking as you as you're talking there about the phenomenal we experienced in the early stages of of look Covid lockdown that completely shifted people's perspective on can't. Can't do that We can't do that We can't do that. Suddenly we had to and we did and all those rules we've been hanging on to about working for the home working remotely. How can we manage people. We can't see them from a business perspective. All those things um, globally went out the window overnight.
Arnaud Saint Paul: More yeah.
Joanne Lockwood: And businesses reacting quickly and what frustrates me is that we've got a short mind what we're saying now is we're all trying to control it back Again. We're saying we've got major global ceos saying well if I can't see you I can't trust you, we need one back in our office because it works better for creativity where it's better for this but better. Think that that negates the lived experience of all of their employees with air hang on it I was working really really hard. We We we were very productive because there is a certain mindset amongst maybe senior leaders Senior Leadership teams. Where the control is still necessary and as you say there's the the feminine the masculine elements here and the control is coming back in with the masculine type. Trust I think trust is big thing here I can't see you I can't trust you I can't control you and. People get nervous. They they feel that what's my purpose if I'm not in charge in control. That's the mantra we've tried to say leaders must be in charge in control and what we've proved is we leaders don't know leaders are as vulnerable as everybody else, they're all in that same boat together.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Are.
Joanne Lockwood: But we're we're forgetting that and we're trying to go back to where we were I think you said at the beginning how we're in this cyclical kind of we keep repeating the lessons and we're not. We're not learning.
Arnaud Saint Paul: I Really see all these cycles are like a pendulum we we go one way we explore what it is to be super controlling. For instance, that's where we're coming from then we went the other way which is nobody at in the office. And now we're going this way and we're saying oh maybe it's not that good and then you know so it's always seeking that average point that makes sense the balance. That's what life is about finding the new balance again and again and again and.
Joanne Lockwood: A.
Arnaud Saint Paul: If there is no tension. No balance can be found and with attention comes the contrast that allows me to see Oh maybe I want to choose something else which is what we were talking about earlier too and that brings me to a new place where I can again visit.
Joanne Lockwood: Um.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Ah, new aspect of me me being company me being a society of me being an individual It's the same thing and it helps me to go from a state of cacophony to a state of symphony at some point whenever I'm ready for it and that's. The gist of our whole life and for or any company. Any team. Any Ceo any leader of their own of our lives.
Joanne Lockwood: I see something similar happening when we when we talk about diversity and inclusion or diversity in the workplace from Society We most people would say yes we want fairness. Yes, we want equity. Yes, we want people to succeed and then we try and look.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Wow.
Joanne Lockwood: Anti-racism. We try and look at Anti-homophobia all these kind of solutions and what happens is it has momentum and then people who are maybe in the privileged group going On. You're you're catching up with me too quickly. Yeah, change is too Fast. We need to put the brakes on this. We can't We can't just rush into this. We need to slow it down. Ah, course that creates this tension this pin as you're saying where the people have being used to having this momentum people who have privileged start to rebel back and go hang on a minute you're you're now denying me as a white person the opportunity. Ah, and.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Are.
Joanne Lockwood: Ah, that gets cautioned and I and I always think it's It's a signal that change is occurring because you get this back. Pressure is almost like this fight back it means we've just got to keep that momentum going and hold our ground and and not let if you like the the incumbent thinking.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, and.
Joanne Lockwood: Stop and take it over because I think it's going back to what you're saying is if if the the people who have the power of the privilege who are saying no reframed they stop they pause and what am I really losing? What am I Gain. What's the world got a game. We talk about esgs talk about all these things and equality diversity is all baked into the heart of that. Sustainability looking out for our planet climate change if we start becoming resistant to this all we're doing is creating a society that is is going to hit some buffers you know, probably in our in our lifetime we're going to have significant changes.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Quote.
Joanne Lockwood: If not if not already just looking at the way the ice caps are mounting the the global warming if I get to my 75 years old there will be some significant changes in the next fifteen to 20 years let alone my my grandchildren and the future generations are going have to face where. But we've we've cashed a lot checks and we've created a massive earth overdraft that we're going have to start paying back.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, indeed.
Joanne Lockwood: Ah know it's been fascinating talking to you I've I've loved our conversation and we hadn't really had a conversation before we hadn't had a conversation before today and I picked up everything for. We're just just this is just the beginning of our conversation. So it's been absolutely fascinating coming into a podcast like this really not knowing what we were going to talk about.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Know we just are that.
Joanne Lockwood: And just exploring this and find that there's There's so much synergy and so many concepts that you raise that resonate with me deeply and it's been fascinating. So thank you so much for your time and and being on.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Thanks you, it's ah, really ah, a pleasure to have had this conversation very very. Ah so you know I have a website ah tapwa.comtapuat.com
Joanne Lockwood: And how could people get hold of you. What's the best way of people.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Where they can find my books we have a cruise on the nile to help people find harmony within then we have the heartful method for groups or individual guidance as well and you know I'm animating. Workshops in Zuriich and maybe in London soon and and seeing you know how we can help more and more people to to grow into their into their own heart and and find that. Love that they have already but they forgot it so it's all a matter of yeah, how can we live in harmony with ourselves and find that music that we hold inside and bringing it out in the world as a symphony.
Joanne Lockwood: I Love that so find the love they've forgotten and bringing it out as a Symphony all those multi multi strands of our of our essence um all different instruments. Yeah, the wind the string and the.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Um, yes, yes.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Which nevers my instrument. That's that's all all good and oh mix of they are of right and and and and we also helped teams to find coherence I was organizing a cruise with 60 change makers and we.
Joanne Lockwood: The percussion all coming together making that beautiful music.
Arnaud Saint Paul: Help them to rebalance the faminine and the masculine energies that were really creating a lot of issues and so that also is you know the same thing whether it's ah, an individual or a team bringing them from a place of cacophony to a place of Symphony. That's the whole thing and it you know it's a gift we can give to ourselves if we choose to. It's an amazing one ready. Thank you.
Joanne Lockwood: Ano. Thank you Thank you so much. A huge thank you also to our listeners for tuning in getting to the end today. Please do keep ah subscribed to keep updates on future episodes of the inclusion Bites podcast that's b I t yes. Please share with your friends and colleagues I've got a number of other exciting guests lined up that I'm sure you'll be equally inspired by over the next few weeks and months and also if you'd like to be a guest. Please let me know'd love to have you on the show and of course I always welcome feedback and suggestions for future shows. How and how we can improve. Ah, just email me joe.lockwoodacchangehappen.code Uk. Finally, my name is Joanne Lockwood it's been an absolute pleasure to host his podcast you today catch you next time. Bye.