Joanne Lockwood: Foreign.
Joanne Lockwood: Welcome to Inclusion Bites, your sanctuary
Joanne Lockwood: for bold conversations that spark change. I'm Joanne Lockwood,
Joanne Lockwood: your guide on this journey of exploration into the heart of
Joanne Lockwood: inclusion, belonging and societal transformation.
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Joanne Lockwood: ignite the spark of inclusion with Inclusion Bites.
Joanne Lockwood: And today is episode 191 with the
Joanne Lockwood: title Joyful Energy, Breakable
Joanne Lockwood: Spirit. And I have the absolute honour and privilege to welcome Naseem
Joanne Lockwood: Rochette. Naseem is an award winning author, a keynote
Joanne Lockwood: speaker and joy seeker who seeks to help people
Joanne Lockwood: reframe their storeys and help discover growth
Joanne Lockwood: in life's toughest moments. When I asked Naseem to describe her
Joanne Lockwood: superpower, she said that it is radiating joyful energy that
Joanne Lockwood: inspires optimism in the face of adversity.
Joanne Lockwood: Wow. Hello, Naseem, welcome to the show. Hi, Jo.
Naseem Rochette: Thank you for having me. And I hope that's my superpower. That's
Naseem Rochette: what I try. Sounds amazing. And
Joanne Lockwood: wow. I'm judging by the accent, you're not
Joanne Lockwood: over here in the uk, where I'm based. Whereabouts in the world are you? I
Naseem Rochette: wish that I were, but no, I am in New Jersey. Not that I don't
Naseem Rochette: love, you know, my life here in New Jersey, but I do love the uk.
Naseem Rochette: Yeah, it's a hot, sunny May Day. No, June day
Naseem Rochette: here in New Jersey. Wow. Is it
Joanne Lockwood: disproportionately warm? You know, it's like talking about the weather. Is it? Is it, you
Naseem Rochette: know, like, it's a perfect day, but my office
Naseem Rochette: is my third floor attic, so it's a little bit hot up here. But, you
Naseem Rochette: know, I shouldn't complain about the sun. No, no, there's plenty
Joanne Lockwood: of going on in the world right now that we can complain about. The sun.
Joanne Lockwood: The sun, yes. There's plenty of craziness in
Naseem Rochette: the world right now. I need to appreciate. We always, although we always need to
Naseem Rochette: appreciate the little things especially, yeah, we're.
Joanne Lockwood: Less than a week on from the audacious
Joanne Lockwood: Ukrainian drone strike, aren't we where it, that's just to put
Joanne Lockwood: a date and time on this, you know, that was a bit audacious. Zelensky
Joanne Lockwood: Web. Yeah, there's a lot of, a lot of
Naseem Rochette: very concerning stuff going on in the world here in the U.S.
Naseem Rochette: you know, in the Mideast, in Europe. It's really hard to believe, which
Naseem Rochette: is why I think it's even more important. I love the work that you do,
Naseem Rochette: Jo, in making people feel included, because there is so
Naseem Rochette: much in the world that's happening that is, could,
Naseem Rochette: could divide us further. Yeah, no, I agree. And
Joanne Lockwood: it's, we get around the table and start having conversations
Joanne Lockwood: around a table rather than throwing rocks at each other across the, across
Joanne Lockwood: the garden wall, if you like. We're doing often. Yeah. So your, your
Joanne Lockwood: superpower is about radiating joyful energy. As I said just now.
Joanne Lockwood: Where did that come from? What got you into doing what you do? You know,
Naseem Rochette: so it's, it's interesting. So I've always, on some level, been
Naseem Rochette: a joy seeker. You know, I was, I was, When I
Naseem Rochette: was a kid, I was, I was kind of a happy kid, but I was
Naseem Rochette: also a really, really insecure kid, you know, just
Naseem Rochette: paralysed with fear, shy. I grew up in New Jersey. You know, when I grew
Naseem Rochette: up, I'm 54 now, there were really no Indians in
Naseem Rochette: my town. I'm, you know, I'm of Indian origin. And I always
Naseem Rochette: felt different and like I didn't belong. But I also,
Naseem Rochette: also had this happy, you know, this natural inclination to
Naseem Rochette: be happy. I had, you know, know, happy parents, you know, festive. Actually, my
Naseem Rochette: parents were crazy party animals. So, you know, I grew up
Naseem Rochette: in a very social environment. And so when I was, you know,
Naseem Rochette: the weekends with my family, I was, you know, very social and happy.
Naseem Rochette: But, you know, on the weekdays, I was just so
Naseem Rochette: uncomfortable and shy and insecure.
Naseem Rochette: And, you know, I took that insecurity with me actually for,
Naseem Rochette: or I lived in that insecurity for a long, long time.
Naseem Rochette: You know, I, I, I often say that it was, wasn't until my twenties
Naseem Rochette: that I really accepted who I was, that I
Naseem Rochette: was, that I was different and, or I thought differently. And that was all okay.
Naseem Rochette: And then it probably took me another 10 or 15 years to become somebody
Naseem Rochette: that I liked. And all through that, you know, I, I tried
Naseem Rochette: to, you know, I, I had this natural inclination to joy
Naseem Rochette: and, and how do I find happiness? How do I
Naseem Rochette: spread happiness? How do I make people feel good and,
Naseem Rochette: and make them feel different than I felt, which was
Naseem Rochette: uncomfortable and alone and insecure. And I
Naseem Rochette: think that that has just, it's just served like the joy
Naseem Rochette: feeds joy. Oh, I think the joy keeps me energetic and young
Naseem Rochette: and you know, I know we'll talk about. I had a very traumatic accident seven
Naseem Rochette: years ago and I think it's that desire to get back
Naseem Rochette: to joy and the, you know, when I was. Thought I
Naseem Rochette: was dying, you know, like thinking about the joy
Naseem Rochette: of my life, I think those things kept me going, you know, and so
Naseem Rochette: I try to keep that front and centre. I mean, you know, we all
Naseem Rochette: say we only live once. Actually I saw, actually I saw a great little
Naseem Rochette: cartoon on my Instagram recently that said it was like a Snoopy and Charlie Brown.
Naseem Rochette: And I think Charlie Brown said, you know, we only live once. And
Naseem Rochette: Snoopy said, no, we only die once. We live every day.
Naseem Rochette: And I want to live every day with that joy. That's beautiful. That's a really
Joanne Lockwood: beautiful. Yeah, I love that. I think I remember saying that
Joanne Lockwood: and at the time I remember almost like a little tear came in my eye.
Joanne Lockwood: You could feel that inside, can't you? I really, I do. I think
Naseem Rochette: about it all the time. We live every day. I
Joanne Lockwood: didn't, I didn't realise myself that joy was a thing
Joanne Lockwood: until, until that Disney Pixar
Joanne Lockwood: movie Inside Out. And one of the characters,
Joanne Lockwood: haven't you. Oh, you've got to see it. It's one and two. There's two now,
Joanne Lockwood: but one of the characters, basically little characters in the little girl's head.
Joanne Lockwood: And one of the characters is Anger. That little red man
Joanne Lockwood: type characters, always, always angry about something, like a little, like a
Joanne Lockwood: two year old always angry about something. And then what happens is
Joanne Lockwood: Joy, who's the female character, effectively
Joanne Lockwood: sellotapes anger to a chair and says, right, you're
Joanne Lockwood: over there, I'm now running this body. I love that. I went
Joanne Lockwood: through a similar epiphany where I realised that Joy suddenly took over my life
Joanne Lockwood: and that I'd spent a lot of time with anxiety. I spent a lot of
Joanne Lockwood: time with anger and a lot of time all these other emotions in your head.
Joanne Lockwood: And by centering Joy, that allowed me to see
Joanne Lockwood: the world and my life more clearly. So I'm with you here about discovering
Joanne Lockwood: joy. It's amazing. You know, it's interesting you say that about discovering Joy
Naseem Rochette: because I don't know that I used the word joy up until
Naseem Rochette: recently. I don't think I knew it was a thing. As I reflect
Naseem Rochette: back, I know I felt it, but I actually think, you know, some of the
Naseem Rochette: ways that I solidified it solidified maybe that word or that idea
Naseem Rochette: was. Again, during my accident and journey, I
Naseem Rochette: realised that energy feeds energy. You know, we. And I
Naseem Rochette: really believed and learned the effect of having a
Naseem Rochette: positive energy and how that drives momentum. And
Naseem Rochette: I realised that just by the words that I choose and the
Naseem Rochette: energy that I put forth. I drive different
Naseem Rochette: reactions in the people around me. And it doesn't mean life is always easy.
Naseem Rochette: And all our conversations are like, you know, flowers and rainbows and stuff like
Naseem Rochette: that, but the words we choose, the way we say it,
Naseem Rochette: you know, the, the tone of our voice, all of that, you know,
Naseem Rochette: tells a different storey. And if we focus on a storey
Naseem Rochette: with a positive outcome, with, you know, a belief in
Naseem Rochette: joy or an underlying, you know, respect
Naseem Rochette: and desire for joy, I think we drive a much
Naseem Rochette: more positive energy. So you had a pretty significant. Should
Joanne Lockwood: we call it an event? Yeah, understated event, which you can. Obviously you're
Joanne Lockwood: gonna. You're gonna talk a bit about some seven or eight years ago as you,
Joanne Lockwood: as you, as you've mentioned here already, you've hinted at this and this
Joanne Lockwood: is. You call it your unbreakable day
Joanne Lockwood: and tell me what was leading up rather, rather than the day itself.
Joanne Lockwood: What's going on in your life the week before. Yeah, I guess,
Naseem Rochette: you know, we. We really can't have a conversation. I should, should let. Let all
Naseem Rochette: your listeners know what happened because it is so central to so
Naseem Rochette: much of how I think and talk about.
Naseem Rochette: So, you know, I mentioned that I was very insecure. I worked really
Naseem Rochette: hard to like who I was. Well, on May
Naseem Rochette: 21, 2018, so seven years ago, you know, I
Naseem Rochette: woke up on another beautiful sunny day. I'm feeling
Naseem Rochette: really good about myself, really happy in command. You
Naseem Rochette: know, I have three kids, one working full time. I worked at Microsoft back
Naseem Rochette: then. A really robust life that I worked so hard to
Naseem Rochette: build and so hard to appreciate. And, you know, I juggled it all. And
Naseem Rochette: Jo, I like to say, you know, I juggled it all and I made it
Naseem Rochette: look easy. It wasn't easy, but I took pride in the fact that I
Naseem Rochette: could manage all of this. And, you know, I grew up in a household where
Naseem Rochette: women were strong and we didn't ask for help. You know, not asking for help
Naseem Rochette: was a source of pride. So, you know, I started out my
Naseem Rochette: day like that. And by that afternoon, I was in a hospital.
Naseem Rochette: I had been hit by a car and run over
Naseem Rochette: three times. The car hit me and then stopped
Naseem Rochette: and then drove over me and then reversed over me
Naseem Rochette: and then drove over me a third time. And I was pinned underneath the car.
Naseem Rochette: And I'll just let that sit for a minute because I know it's a lot.
Naseem Rochette: I know there's, there's. That's not
Joanne Lockwood: accidental, is it? You know, it seems like it wouldn't be,
Naseem Rochette: but it was, you know, and my husband was actually watching the whole thing.
Naseem Rochette: I was in a pedestrian crosswalk just a couple miles from my house in New
Naseem Rochette: Jersey when a car, you
Naseem Rochette: know, a car turned and hit me in the crosswalk. And the car
Naseem Rochette: actually stopped at first. And then, you know, we don't know
Naseem Rochette: why the driver did all the things. You know, I actually, I wrote a
Naseem Rochette: book about the storey, the unexpected benefits of being run over. Because
Naseem Rochette: there's so much to talk about just in that event, you know, and I
Naseem Rochette: don't know what the driver was thinking, but it wasn't a hit. You know, my
Naseem Rochette: husband didn't hire anyone to kill me, luckily. And we think we, you know, we
Naseem Rochette: believe the driver just had a lot of really bad judgement, you know.
Joanne Lockwood: Compounded that by reverse, you know, lost spatial awareness.
Joanne Lockwood: Didn't know what was going on, didn't know where you were. Yeah, I mean, I
Naseem Rochette: have some theories. I think maybe she was trying to flee the scene, maybe she
Naseem Rochette: was trying to then get back to where she hit me in the crosswalk. You
Naseem Rochette: know, maybe eventually she was just trying to get off me. But, you know, everybody
Naseem Rochette: was screaming, you know, just stop. And I, you know, I was
Naseem Rochette: conscious through the whole event.
Naseem Rochette: God, I always get a little even, you know, seven years later
Naseem Rochette: talking about it. I was, you know, I went
Naseem Rochette: from everything to, you know, initially having that, oh my
Naseem Rochette: gosh, she's hitting me on this great day, you know, I'm feeling so good. I've
Naseem Rochette: had such a wonderful day and not worried, you know, thinking I might be a
Naseem Rochette: little black and blue, but no biggie, you know, cocktail party,
Naseem Rochette: storey, whatever. I got hit by a car today, haha. To, you
Naseem Rochette: know, then when she ran over me, you know, I was, I was
Naseem Rochette: wriggling, I was trying to get out from underneath it, you know, I didn't, I
Naseem Rochette: didn't want to die. And then when she reversed over me,
Naseem Rochette: I remember thinking there's something wrong. Like I could hear in
Naseem Rochette: my husband's voice that he was watching me die. I could hear it in the
Naseem Rochette: screams of all the people watching it, that they were watching
Naseem Rochette: someone die. And I had, in those moments, which I'm, you
Naseem Rochette: know, actually feel, I call it a magical accident because
Naseem Rochette: there's so much that I feel lucky for
Naseem Rochette: and that I think I have learned. And one of those things was when I
Naseem Rochette: was underneath the car thinking, you know, I don't even say 99, I
Naseem Rochette: was a hundred percent sure I was going to die. I started reflecting back on
Naseem Rochette: my life and you know, having those end of life thoughts.
Naseem Rochette: And I remember thinking, you know, why didn't I write my
Naseem Rochette: kids letters? I travelled. Every time I get on a plane I'd think, oh, I
Naseem Rochette: should write them letters just in case, you know, I never did it. And then,
Naseem Rochette: you know, my thoughts and it was like 20 minutes of conversation even, you know,
Naseem Rochette: in these matter of seconds, you know, cause everything was in slow motion for
Naseem Rochette: me. And then I came to the conclusion that although I didn't write
Naseem Rochette: my kids any letters, you know, we've had so much
Naseem Rochette: joy, you know, we've had great vacations, we would dance
Naseem Rochette: around the kitchen. We were like, we're a happy gang. And
Naseem Rochette: I thought, you know, even though I'm. They're going to lose their
Naseem Rochette: mom, they know who I am because we've had that joy. I've been
Naseem Rochette: present, I've, I've filled, you know, their life
Naseem Rochette: with love and I felt so good about that. But you know what Jo? I
Naseem Rochette: also realised that I did that for my kids, but I didn't do that
Naseem Rochette: for the other people in my life. No one else really knew how important they
Naseem Rochette: were. I wasn't super effusive and appreciative, you know, I was
Naseem Rochette: always like nice and caring. But I don't think most
Naseem Rochette: people in my life that had an impact, whether big or small,
Naseem Rochette: knew the positive effects or that I appreciated,
Naseem Rochette: you know, what they did. And I felt like there was a lot left unsaid
Naseem Rochette: in the, you know, in the community and in my friend circle
Naseem Rochette: and that I felt, felt some regret. But both of those things really
Naseem Rochette: helped me afterwards in how I wanted to live. There were, there were no
Naseem Rochette: thoughts about I should have saved more money, I wish I got more promotions. It
Naseem Rochette: was, it was all about people in the people I connected with. As
Joanne Lockwood: you're talking, as you first started talking about that and
Joanne Lockwood: I, I have a habit of not reading
Joanne Lockwood: the briefing notes that you sent through. So I, I flicked through it and I
Joanne Lockwood: saw something about being unbreakable, I saw something about being a life changing but
Joanne Lockwood: I didn't really get into the weeds of that and
Joanne Lockwood: I, I've, I've effectively discovered everything you just said at the same time.
Joanne Lockwood: If you're listening to this, I heard that for the same time
Joanne Lockwood: and as you were describing it, the visual Image I had in my head
Joanne Lockwood: was the end of the previous series of Handmaid's Tale.
Joanne Lockwood: And if you've seen this, but the lead character, June, she gets run over
Joanne Lockwood: by a pickup and that person is trying to hurt them
Joanne Lockwood: and they're reversing back. So you're. You're describing it. I didn't hear that. For me.
Naseem Rochette: Cause, no, I didn't see it yet. But. Sorry, spoiler
Joanne Lockwood: alert. Spoiler alert. But the good news is she survives
Joanne Lockwood: and she's a fighter like you. But. So I've got
Joanne Lockwood: this real image in my head of. As
Joanne Lockwood: you were describing it, I had a vision. I wasn't trying to create a picture.
Joanne Lockwood: I had one. And that's why it was impactful for me. And
Joanne Lockwood: when you tell that storey to people, people go,
Joanne Lockwood: obviously, they're shocked, they're stunned. Do they know what to say? Do they know
Joanne Lockwood: what to ask? Cause I've got loads of questions in my head. I'm thinking, I'm
Joanne Lockwood: going to ask these questions in a bit because that's one of the privileges I
Joanne Lockwood: have of being the host on this show. But do people struggle to sort of.
Naseem Rochette: To say they do? I try to give people a minute to digest it, you
Naseem Rochette: know, when. When there's time, because I often forget quite how ridiculous
Naseem Rochette: it is. And I think people, people, their first reaction is,
Naseem Rochette: you know, I'm sorry. Like, that's so horrible. But what's interesting is, for me is
Naseem Rochette: it's. It's like I learned so much. There's so much joy that has come out
Naseem Rochette: of it that I don't look at it as. You know, actually
Naseem Rochette: recently I had to do this timeline of positive and negative things.
Naseem Rochette: And the accident, oddly, was not a negative thing. You know, it was on the
Naseem Rochette: positive trajectory because of all I learned. But, you know, as
Naseem Rochette: you said, people definitely don't know what to say when it happened.
Naseem Rochette: In fact, you know, I don't know if these things are funny. They're funny to
Naseem Rochette: me. But when I did write the book, and the book came out and
Naseem Rochette: I explained quite the seriousness of the journey and all the things that I learned.
Naseem Rochette: Learned. So many people in the periphery of my life said, you know, when I
Naseem Rochette: heard the storey, I thought someone was kidding. I didn't actually
Naseem Rochette: believe that you were run over three times. Most people
Naseem Rochette: just. It's just so nonsensical that I would be run over three
Naseem Rochette: times, that a lot of people just didn't believe that it was true. My dad.
Joanne Lockwood: I'm going to ask. I'm going to ask the question that's going through my head.
Joanne Lockwood: And if you're listening to this, I'm trying to ask the question on your behalf
Joanne Lockwood: as well. These are the questions that people say, oh, you should never ask
Joanne Lockwood: that. You should never. It obviously hurt. Which part of you was run
Joanne Lockwood: over or was it. Or was it all over? So I was. So when
Naseem Rochette: the car first hit, it was, you know, kind of chest level. It was a
Naseem Rochette: big suv, a big white SUV when it. And then, you know, the
Naseem Rochette: tyres went over me five times. So they went over my. My
Naseem Rochette: knees, they went over my chest. And this is the
Naseem Rochette: craziest. They went over my head and neck.
Naseem Rochette: So, you know, it. It went over my head and over my
Naseem Rochette: neck. The cars went over my, My head. And I remember. And
Naseem Rochette: Jo, the, the look you like. That was how I was thinking about it
Naseem Rochette: after, because I was conscious and I knew what happened. My husband saw what happened.
Naseem Rochette: Other people saw what happened. But I thought, how can a car run over my
Naseem Rochette: head and neck and run over me and I'm still alive. And I
Naseem Rochette: remember after the accident, I kept wondering, like, it couldn't have really
Naseem Rochette: happened. Like, there's no way that really happened. And a week
Naseem Rochette: later, and I call this, you know, again, if anyone
Naseem Rochette: sees my website or book or anything, you might see this picture. There is
Naseem Rochette: a picture of my neck with tyre marks
Naseem Rochette: that showed up a few days later. And I call that my favourite accident picture
Naseem Rochette: because it was the proof that it really did happen.
Naseem Rochette: I mean, I had the pain, but I. I didn't really believe
Naseem Rochette: it. And here's another crazy thing. I didn't break any bones.
Joanne Lockwood: That was my next question. So you didn't break any bones? No, I mean, I.
Naseem Rochette: I had a lot of very serious injuries. You know, I was
Naseem Rochette: crushed. So, you know, I had a lot of internal injuries.
Naseem Rochette: You know, I couldn't walk. I had to have surgery on my eye. You know,
Naseem Rochette: I had nerve damage. You know, I was pretty immobile for a while.
Naseem Rochette: And I have a traumatic brain injury. I, I still, you
Naseem Rochette: know, I, I don't think how I used to think, but I didn't break any
Naseem Rochette: bones. So I was actually never admitted to the hospital.
Naseem Rochette: So 24 hours later, I was back at home trying to
Naseem Rochette: navigate what, being a mom. Yeah, yeah, that was probably one of the
Naseem Rochette: hardest. You know, there. There were many things that were hard that was very hard.
Naseem Rochette: The driver's lack of remorse was really hard. There were a
Naseem Rochette: couple things that probably didn't need to be as hard that were, you know, real
Naseem Rochette: lessons. So you said to the driver's lack of remorse.
Joanne Lockwood: They understand the gravity of what happened. It was kind of like, were they trying
Joanne Lockwood: to imprint it was your fault for getting in the way or something? Yeah, kind
Naseem Rochette: of. So at the. At the scene, the driver. So my
Naseem Rochette: husband was at the scene. So the driver got out of the car, and she
Naseem Rochette: was like a toddler throwing a tantrum. And my husband actually
Naseem Rochette: said, like, don't you even care what happened to her? Like, she didn't even. She
Naseem Rochette: just seemed to be worried about herself. And, you know, I remember the. The
Naseem Rochette: witnesses, you know, the other people there had to move her away because they couldn't
Naseem Rochette: even talk to me, to try to keep me conscious and alert because of all
Naseem Rochette: her screaming. And. But look, you know, that. That's
Naseem Rochette: shock. You know, I actually held. But, yeah, trauma. I get it. Yeah. Yeah.
Naseem Rochette: And. And I thought, you know, she didn't mean to run over me three times.
Naseem Rochette: Like, obviously, a lot of bad decisions, bad judgement, but I actually
Naseem Rochette: held no ill will to. And when I said, you know, we got
Naseem Rochette: a notice in the mail, like a victim's notice, that she was going to be
Naseem Rochette: in court, you know, four or five weeks later. So my husband and my daughter
Naseem Rochette: and I went to the courthouse, and she was just a few
Naseem Rochette: feet away from me. You know, I was bandaged, Cane, you
Naseem Rochette: know, scars on my face, you know, glasses,
Naseem Rochette: like, you know, I was. I was still in bad shape. And, you know, she
Naseem Rochette: had seen my husband, and she was a few feet away, didn't acknowledge
Naseem Rochette: us, you know, nothing. There was, like,
Naseem Rochette: no human kindness or interaction or, you know, I hope
Naseem Rochette: you're okay, or anything. And I remember it was like
Naseem Rochette: someone pushed me off a cliff at that moment. That's the moment that I
Naseem Rochette: fully lost control of, you know, my emotions.
Naseem Rochette: There was no joy because till that. Till that day, I felt no ill
Naseem Rochette: will. She didn't mean to do it. But when I saw no kindness, no
Naseem Rochette: connection, nothing from her, it just broke me. I'm just thinking, if
Joanne Lockwood: she'd have come up to you in tears, full of remorse
Joanne Lockwood: and devastated, and say, can we hug?
Joanne Lockwood: You'd have gone, of course we could hug. Couldn't you? You could have done that.
Joanne Lockwood: But as you say, because someone doesn't treat you in
Joanne Lockwood: that way, that there's no acknowledgment of your pain, your trauma and your
Joanne Lockwood: family and everyone who knows you, then
Joanne Lockwood: I'm more upset around that reaction than I am around.
Naseem Rochette: Yeah. As you are. As you say, that's where you lost it. Yeah.
Naseem Rochette: Really. Really. You know, when I Say like pushed me off a cliff. I actually
Naseem Rochette: that day I went home and you know, when my kids think about this day,
Naseem Rochette: they still get teary eyed because the mom that was
Naseem Rochette: so joyful was, you know, the happy life we had
Naseem Rochette: on that day, it hit rock bottom, you know, I went home, I remember my
Naseem Rochette: youngest child said, asked if he could go to the pool. You know, it was
Naseem Rochette: a nice day. And I started screaming at him. I was screaming at our
Naseem Rochette: babysitter at all my kids. Like they, they didn't know who
Naseem Rochette: they were getting when they would ask me something because I just, I
Naseem Rochette: was so broken, you know, for a minute. And then that's actually the day that
Naseem Rochette: I started. I realised that I no longer could control
Naseem Rochette: my mental state without more help. And I started on
Naseem Rochette: antidepressants and anti anxiety that day. I love analogies and
Joanne Lockwood: metaphors and similes and things like this. And what's jumping into my head
Joanne Lockwood: here is Star Wars Jedis and Siths
Joanne Lockwood: and the hard thing here is trying to stay in the Jedi
Joanne Lockwood: camp and not get engrossed with anger and
Joanne Lockwood: revenge and all that. That must have been really difficult because it
Joanne Lockwood: sounds like you were leaning into the Sith there in the dark side, weren't you?
Naseem Rochette: Well, yeah, you know, I, it's, it's strange. I'm
Naseem Rochette: not sure that it was ever anger. I think it was anger for my husband
Naseem Rochette: and for my daughter and you know, all the people that loved me. But for
Naseem Rochette: me it was just such a sadness, such a
Naseem Rochette: disappointment, you know. And I don't know
Naseem Rochette: that I've ever really had anger for her, but I've just,
Naseem Rochette: you know, I just, I just felt sad. You know, I still feel sad, but
Naseem Rochette: I, you know, I focus on the life that I get to lead
Naseem Rochette: and the way that I treat people and the decisions I make. And
Naseem Rochette: you know, I've also, I've also come to reconcile it. You know, one of the
Naseem Rochette: other things that I learned during this journey is sometimes the people
Naseem Rochette: you think are going to show up for you in your times of need
Naseem Rochette: don't or don't show up the way you expect them to show up for you.
Naseem Rochette: What I have realised is that we have no
Naseem Rochette: idea the traumas and the triggers of the people around
Naseem Rochette: us. For instance, today nobody looks at me and says, wow, she was run over
Naseem Rochette: three times. Like I'm sure she can't cross the street. Like no one has any
Naseem Rochette: idea what goes on. And I think that, I think that people, you know, we
Naseem Rochette: don't necessarily know what those triggers are for the People around us. And
Naseem Rochette: I think that my accident, and seeing me broken and bruised
Naseem Rochette: and disfigured and just so weak after being
Naseem Rochette: so such a strong person, you know, it was. Was hard
Naseem Rochette: for people. And I think that. That
Naseem Rochette: sometimes they can't show up. It's. It's their defence mechanism,
Naseem Rochette: you know, it's their body protecting them, their mind protecting them.
Naseem Rochette: And so I now attribute that to the driver. Maybe the
Naseem Rochette: way that she deals with that accident is by
Naseem Rochette: pretending it didn't happen. And is that how I would deal with it? No.
Naseem Rochette: But maybe that's her way of protecting herself. I don't live
Naseem Rochette: that way. But you know what? I.
Joanne Lockwood: Do a lot of training on challenging conversations and workplace
Joanne Lockwood: conflicts, all this kind of thing. And one of the golden rules is you have
Joanne Lockwood: to meet people where they're at, you have to understand where someone is,
Joanne Lockwood: because if you start judging them by where you're at, you
Joanne Lockwood: have no idea what's going on in their life. And you somehow, to create that
Joanne Lockwood: relatable experience, you have to find out where they are. I guess you don't really
Joanne Lockwood: know where she was or what she's at. So by judging her,
Joanne Lockwood: she may well have been in abusive relationships, you may have been trying to escape
Joanne Lockwood: something. She may have had, I don't know, something going on in her mind or
Joanne Lockwood: her own mental health concerns. And by judging it by your standards
Joanne Lockwood: isn't really. It's not going to get anywhere. So, yeah,
Joanne Lockwood: that must be the frustration, I suppose, is it sounds like today, even now,
Joanne Lockwood: you're not sure where she was at. It just. Yeah, I
Naseem Rochette: mean, I saw her a few years later,
Naseem Rochette: you know, the insurance legal team was deposing us. And when I
Naseem Rochette: saw her that day, too, I was going around introducing myself to everybody, you know,
Naseem Rochette: and when I didn't know she was going to be there and when she walked
Naseem Rochette: in, I didn't want to be rude, I went and I shook her hand and
Naseem Rochette: I introduced myself. And I remember even at that moment feeling like,
Naseem Rochette: squeeze my hand, do something. And I didn't get
Naseem Rochette: that. And then when she talked about the accident, she
Naseem Rochette: almost talked about it like, I wasn't really in a crosswalk, there weren't really
Naseem Rochette: people there. She, like, that witnessed it, you know, almost said it
Naseem Rochette: didn't happen. And that is her defence. That's where she
Naseem Rochette: is, that's where she's staying. And I'm just. I'm
Naseem Rochette: not engaging. No. When you come across people
Joanne Lockwood: with personality disorders, narcissistic tendencies, whatever it may be,
Joanne Lockwood: you have to disengage and step away, because nothing you can say will change that.
Naseem Rochette: Yeah. And as you said, you know, it's. It's meeting them where they are, you
Naseem Rochette: know, if that's where they are, and that's whether it's by situation
Naseem Rochette: or, you know, by intention. I assume that the law
Joanne Lockwood: and law enforcement gave her something
Joanne Lockwood: to think about. No. She lost her. Her licence for 10
Naseem Rochette: days and got a ticket of her failure to yield to a pedestrian.
Joanne Lockwood: Is that it? Not attempted murder or attempted manslaughter or grievous bodily harm.
Naseem Rochette: No, there was nothing. Just a
Naseem Rochette: traffic violation. Wow, that must
Joanne Lockwood: have been salt on the wound. It was, yeah. Yeah. Especially when I was,
Naseem Rochette: you know, so. So, you know, badly
Naseem Rochette: injured and, you know, how my life changed. I couldn't drive
Naseem Rochette: for, you know, several weeks, couple months, you know, and she lost her
Naseem Rochette: licence for 10 days. But, you know, again, there was so much that I've learned
Naseem Rochette: from it, you know, that I can only focus, or
Naseem Rochette: I am choosing to focus on what I can control.
Joanne Lockwood: I mean, I just think you could have done an O.J. simpson and gone for
Joanne Lockwood: a civil claim, couldn't you? And sort of. If the law doesn't protect you, then
Joanne Lockwood: we do the civil. You know, the thing,
Naseem Rochette: though, is then it keeps that wound open for me. Yeah, it
Joanne Lockwood: does, yeah. And look, you know, we've. I'm. I'm very
Naseem Rochette: fortunate, you know, I have a good job, good family,
Naseem Rochette: happy life. You know, obviously, there are always
Naseem Rochette: challenges and this was very challenging and has changed me,
Naseem Rochette: but, you know, I want to focus on. On all that. Good.
Joanne Lockwood: And you've got a storey. You got a book. I do have a book. And
Naseem Rochette: actually, so the book, you know, the unexpected benefits of being run
Naseem Rochette: over and that is, you know, many people think it's figurative, but it's literal. Yeah.
Naseem Rochette: The book is actually something I had no plan to write. So when the
Naseem Rochette: accident happened and I went to the hospital and we discovered I didn't
Naseem Rochette: break any bones, many of the nurses and doctors, you
Naseem Rochette: know, it was a. It was a miracle and kept saying, you need to pay
Naseem Rochette: it forward. You know, you need to. You need to do something. You know, this
Naseem Rochette: is a miracle. And I remember thinking, you know, I. I can't even
Naseem Rochette: open my eyes. I can't move. Like, I don't want the burden of having to
Naseem Rochette: pay it forward. But it did plant a seed. And, you know, I kept
Naseem Rochette: thinking about how, you know, how can I
Naseem Rochette: make something good out of this? And one of
Naseem Rochette: the things that happened, you know, in that first year, you know, I I talk
Naseem Rochette: about joy and a happy life. My life wasn't so happy after this
Naseem Rochette: accident. I would wake up crying every day. I couldn't move. My
Naseem Rochette: brain didn't work. You know, I. You know, I couldn't hold a coffee cup,
Naseem Rochette: I couldn't zip my sweatshirt. You know, I couldn't fill out a camp form. Like
Naseem Rochette: all those things that you don't think about, I couldn't do. It was very,
Naseem Rochette: very, very hard. But we made the decision. You know, you talked
Naseem Rochette: about Unbreakable Day. We made the decision that we were going to get back to
Naseem Rochette: a happy storey. And the day of the accident wasn't going to be the
Naseem Rochette: day that almost killed me. It was going to be the day that I survived.
Naseem Rochette: And we reframed it, you know, and
Naseem Rochette: that reframing allowed us to really change the energy
Naseem Rochette: around the storey. I didn't die that day when I should have.
Naseem Rochette: I survived. And then we started to look at all of the
Naseem Rochette: things that you learn in those moments. Because the accident didn't just happen
Naseem Rochette: to me. It happened to everyone that loved me. It happened to my kids, to
Naseem Rochette: my husband, to my friends. And there's so many things that I learned, you know,
Naseem Rochette: one of which is people needed to help me
Naseem Rochette: in their. To heal themselves. And I needed to
Naseem Rochette: learn how to let them. I mentioned, I tried to make it look easy and,
Naseem Rochette: you know, not accepting help was strength to me. But I
Naseem Rochette: learned that accepting help, letting people help, is actually another
Naseem Rochette: dimension of strength. And sometimes that's about them because they need
Naseem Rochette: to participate in the journey, you know, whether or not I, I might need
Naseem Rochette: the support, you know, and, and that when you let yourself have the support,
Naseem Rochette: sometimes it's just really, it's really beautiful how
Naseem Rochette: people want to give and help and, you know, do good.
Naseem Rochette: So those were, so those were some of the things I was learning. And I
Naseem Rochette: would send out, you know, an email every year on, on Unbreakable
Naseem Rochette: Day and, and say, you know, here are some of the things that I learned.
Naseem Rochette: That was my way of paying it forward. And when we were
Naseem Rochette: in lockdown with COVID I realised some of those things that
Naseem Rochette: I learned would be of value on a broader basis. We were living in,
Naseem Rochette: like, this giant Unbreakable Day. And honestly, if
Naseem Rochette: I could have, if I could have just said, hey, here are these 10 lessons
Naseem Rochette: world, you know, take that, you know, I'm, I'm done. I would have
Naseem Rochette: just shared that and probably not have a book or anything.
Naseem Rochette: You know, I realised people need to know the context and my storey for those
Naseem Rochette: lessons to really have meaning. You know, there's a, there's a section in my book
Naseem Rochette: called the Sermon and those are my, Those are my 10 lessons. But the first
Naseem Rochette: couple parts of the book are about who I am, the journey,
Naseem Rochette: how my first transformation of being a person I like to
Naseem Rochette: that person falling, falling apart and then having to rebuild and
Naseem Rochette: hopefully being a better, stronger person, you know, or a different, you
Naseem Rochette: know, more, more connected person, you know,
Naseem Rochette: that's, that's kind of how the book happened. The book, you know, is, is often
Naseem Rochette: regarded as a self help or an inspiration or motivational,
Naseem Rochette: but it is also a memoir. And it's, you know, I'm sharing probably a lot
Naseem Rochette: more than I would ever have been comfortable sharing with people about, you know, the
Naseem Rochette: struggles, about, you know, my insecurities as a child.
Naseem Rochette: You know, candidly, you know, I'll share about a, you know, a suicide
Naseem Rochette: attempt that I had never, ever talked about, but then realised
Naseem Rochette: even, you know, young people especially need to know the
Naseem Rochette: storey can change, your storey can change. And there's so
Naseem Rochette: much power in reframing. And so
Naseem Rochette: that's, that's why the book happened because I felt
Naseem Rochette: people need an inventory and they need to know
Naseem Rochette: that it's possible to come out of something really, really
Naseem Rochette: horrible and be okay. And you might not be the person you
Naseem Rochette: were before, but you, that doesn't have to be bad. You have to be kind
Naseem Rochette: enough to not judge yourself for that. And it was lessons like that
Naseem Rochette: that I felt were so important to share. Because, you know, another thing
Naseem Rochette: I learned through this journey was that we all go through something.
Naseem Rochette: I was run over by a car three times, that maybe people haven't experienced that,
Naseem Rochette: but people have experienced deaths and job losses and
Naseem Rochette: other accidents and things that are traumatic.
Naseem Rochette: We've all gone through something and when we share what we've been through, we,
Naseem Rochette: we also give licence to other people to share. Are you brave?
Joanne Lockwood: I'm sure people say to you, you're brave all the time. So are you.
Naseem Rochette: I'm joyful. Joyful. Good. Good
Joanne Lockwood: answer. Maybe I'm brave only to be, you know, only to reach that joy.
Joanne Lockwood: I find, you know, and many people I know who've been through something really
Joanne Lockwood: significant in their life, people come out and go, they
Joanne Lockwood: want to tell you how brave you are, tell you how I couldn't have done
Joanne Lockwood: that. And they want to sort of put this on you and then you want
Joanne Lockwood: them to go, it's okay, you could have done it too. I've not anyone special.
Joanne Lockwood: And you feel like you have to go through this sort of, this way of
Joanne Lockwood: letting someone down and go, I'm just a human being. I've just dealt with. I'm
Joanne Lockwood: just playing the cards that I given at the time. In 10 seconds
Joanne Lockwood: of my life, suddenly I went from being this person to this person. I wasn't
Joanne Lockwood: brave, I just carried on, actually. And, you know, I'm so glad you, you, you
Naseem Rochette: brought that point up because something I should share is a way
Naseem Rochette: that I learned to talk about how this is just my journey.
Naseem Rochette: So when right after the accident, I had, you know, as. As much
Naseem Rochette: as I didn't like accepting help from people, you know, that I was close to
Naseem Rochette: me. My doctors convinced me to see a trauma therapist and the trauma
Naseem Rochette: therapist taught me about the, The Japanese art of
Naseem Rochette: kintsugi, where you take a broken piece of pottery
Naseem Rochette: and you put it back together with a gold Ted lasso. Broken, isn't it? On
Joanne Lockwood: Ted lasso, yeah. And, you know, and, and the philosophy is that gold
Naseem Rochette: inlay, those cracks make the vase more beautiful. And
Naseem Rochette: I really, really caught, you know, latched onto that idea.
Naseem Rochette: And actually I would even. I had scars all over my face. I would put
Naseem Rochette: gold glitter on my scars, you know, rather than try to hide them,
Naseem Rochette: because I decided this was, this was my journey. And just that idea
Naseem Rochette: allowed me to talk about my struggles, not as a
Naseem Rochette: victim, but this is my journey. And
Naseem Rochette: just having, realising that reframing let me be more
Naseem Rochette: open and more vulnerable and share in ways that I couldn't have
Naseem Rochette: before. Do you ever get that feeling where
Joanne Lockwood: you press pause on your life for a moment and you were kind of
Joanne Lockwood: above looking down at you going, I now see everything more
Joanne Lockwood: clearly. I see where I am in the world, what's going on around. Do you
Joanne Lockwood: ever get that kind of allow yourself to see a bigger perspective of who you
Joanne Lockwood: were? Did that happen? You know, I think in
Naseem Rochette: moments it did, you know, and there was in that early
Naseem Rochette: year, even in those first moments, I mean, I, like when I thought I
Naseem Rochette: was dying, you know, I felt, I think I had that clarity.
Naseem Rochette: Um, and I think, you know, in those early months, in that first
Naseem Rochette: maybe year or two years, I had a more acute
Naseem Rochette: appreciation. But it, it goes away if you don't
Naseem Rochette: purposely remind yourself to embrace it.
Naseem Rochette: Like, I have a, you know, a bunch of tattoos. I don't know if you
Naseem Rochette: can see them. Your listeners certainly can see them, but I, I have a bunch
Naseem Rochette: of tattoos on my arms now to remind me of things
Naseem Rochette: that I learned from the accident because, you know, I'm not
Naseem Rochette: all of a sudden enlightened I, I don't, I don't have all this
Naseem Rochette: wisdom. I mean, I try to. Part of actually the, the gift of
Naseem Rochette: sharing. What I learned is that I have, I get to remind myself
Naseem Rochette: because I, you know, I, we, we have to actively, you
Naseem Rochette: know, work at many of these things. I mean, is it easier for me to
Naseem Rochette: share now and, and, you know, talk about my journey and my
Naseem Rochette: struggles and, you know, maybe what I would have called weaknesses? Absolutely.
Naseem Rochette: But I still have to be intentional about some of the other things I learned
Naseem Rochette: so that I can look at life, you know, more,
Naseem Rochette: you know, at a. At a kind of a more inclusive,
Naseem Rochette: broader level and appreciate and not get lost
Naseem Rochette: in the craziness of a moment or the weight of,
Naseem Rochette: you know, of a momentary struggle.
Joanne Lockwood: A lot of people get stuck down to
Joanne Lockwood: fear of change, fear of the unknown, fear of what if.
Joanne Lockwood: And I presume what you've been through, that barrier was taken away. You were in
Joanne Lockwood: this situation. And the what if is I can't stay where
Joanne Lockwood: I am. I've got to move on. I've got to grow. I've got to do
Joanne Lockwood: something. How do you help people find their transformation where
Joanne Lockwood: they can go from fear to can. Yeah, you know,
Naseem Rochette: and I, I think just in even what you said, it's,
Naseem Rochette: you know, changing from fear to can. Just think about it. It's. It's the words
Naseem Rochette: that you use. It's the storey you tell yourself. It's
Naseem Rochette: the way, like, you know, even. Let's just take the fact that we call the
Naseem Rochette: day of the accident Unbreakable Day, just by simply
Naseem Rochette: reframing and changing the words we use around
Naseem Rochette: what we call that moment. We've done something
Naseem Rochette: dramatically different, you know, for the people that we tell the
Naseem Rochette: storey to, for how we think about that moment and that day.
Naseem Rochette: And it's, it's actually just little things in the
Naseem Rochette: reframing and, you know, I, I often talk about being kind
Naseem Rochette: to yourself, and it's. Actually, I talk about it because many of the people that
Naseem Rochette: first read the book said that's what they took, that they needed to learn to
Naseem Rochette: be kinder to themselves because we are so judgy with ourselves,
Naseem Rochette: you know, but if we, we remember, like,
Naseem Rochette: it's okay if we're not. Life is going to change. It is absolutely going to
Naseem Rochette: change. So there's, there's, you know, but if it's different from
Naseem Rochette: the way it was a year ago, it doesn't have to be bad. You know,
Naseem Rochette: maybe there's some differences that you like more than others
Naseem Rochette: or dislike more than Others. But the way we think about
Naseem Rochette: it, the words we use around it, the words and how we talk about
Naseem Rochette: it to the people around us, all of those things have a
Naseem Rochette: huge, huge impact on how we
Naseem Rochette: will feel those things, on how our body will react to
Naseem Rochette: those things. I actually have had people say to me that on the days of
Naseem Rochette: their accidents they used to just crawl up in a ball in
Naseem Rochette: bed and, or hide in a closet and just be sad and
Naseem Rochette: miserable. But when they started reframing to those days
Naseem Rochette: as their unbreakable days, they started going out and celebrating.
Naseem Rochette: They started having, you know, like ice cream and parties and
Naseem Rochette: just making those days special. And all it was is
Naseem Rochette: a reframing. One of the things I always
Joanne Lockwood: reflect on is that when you're trying to sort your life out,
Joanne Lockwood: you've collected so much baggage over the years. You know, the responsibilities, the
Joanne Lockwood: things, stuff you have in your life. But when it comes to making decisions,
Joanne Lockwood: you think, well, what can I get rid of, what can I lose? It's very
Joanne Lockwood: difficult to sort of peel bits away because they're kind of part of what you've
Joanne Lockwood: got. But when you have, when you start from nothing, you can
Joanne Lockwood: then choose what to bring on. What luggage do I want to now bring on
Joanne Lockwood: my journey and just shed everything and say, right, I guess
Joanne Lockwood: you had a day zero sort of effect
Joanne Lockwood: where you had nothing because you were just millimetres away
Joanne Lockwood: from having dying guess or moments away from dying. So you,
Joanne Lockwood: you've been able to re. Establish your journey of life
Joanne Lockwood: with stuff that's important. Yeah, I mean the, the traumas I think for,
Naseem Rochette: for all of us are a demarcation point. You know, there's definitely like
Naseem Rochette: life before, you know, and life after. But,
Naseem Rochette: but I will say and something that I, you know, I talk about when I
Naseem Rochette: do coaching or keynotes is, you know,
Naseem Rochette: there's so much power in those tough moments.
Naseem Rochette: There's so much we learn and grow from that most of us
Naseem Rochette: don't spend any time thinking about because tough moments
Naseem Rochette: always seem like downers. Let's not talk about those downers,
Naseem Rochette: let's put em in the closet and you know, never talk about them again.
Naseem Rochette: But when we, we actually take some time to
Naseem Rochette: both appreciate and hey, I've navigated something
Naseem Rochette: that was really challenging. I did that, you know, my
Naseem Rochette: family did that, my friends helped me through that. Yeah, that was really,
Naseem Rochette: that was really great that we, we were able to, to
Naseem Rochette: navigate that tough moment. And believe me, it doesn't mean the tough moment wasn't
Naseem Rochette: tough. You know, I lost my parents a couple of years ago. There's nothing
Naseem Rochette: joyful about me losing my parents. But are there things
Naseem Rochette: in ways that I've grown that I can appreciate? Absolutely. Being
Naseem Rochette: run over is obviously a tough moment. Everybody has tough moments. But if you
Naseem Rochette: stop and you think, well, what did I learn from that?
Naseem Rochette: You're again, changing it from baggage to almost
Naseem Rochette: badges, you know, that. That you can feel proud of. Bit like being a girl
Joanne Lockwood: Guide again and getting your cooking badge or your sewing badge or something.
Naseem Rochette: I never got any of those. I was camp cook once. You know,
Joanne Lockwood: I got camp cook badge, chicken in a pot. I
Joanne Lockwood: think it was, I think, something very simple. I was only 10, I think. Yeah,
Joanne Lockwood: I was quite happy with that. So when you're navigating
Joanne Lockwood: the world now, as well as coaching others, how do you find
Joanne Lockwood: yourself approaching these big
Joanne Lockwood: crossroads, these big decision points in your life now? How do you approach things
Joanne Lockwood: differently? You know, for me, joy is one of my
Naseem Rochette: guiding principles. And I think about, you know, does it. Does it bring me joy
Naseem Rochette: or does it bring me stress? And if it's bringing me stress,
Naseem Rochette: you know, and it's a situation that I want to stay in,
Naseem Rochette: you know, then we need to break down. Why is it bringing me stress? And,
Naseem Rochette: you know, if it's a situation that's bringing you stress also, you have to
Naseem Rochette: ask yourself, is it a situation you can get out of and what's the cost
Naseem Rochette: of getting out of it? And I. So that's how I.
Naseem Rochette: I often, you know, work with people. I mean, what are their
Naseem Rochette: guiding principles? Mine is joy. And so. So what are,
Naseem Rochette: you know, what are the things that you want
Naseem Rochette: to feel on a. On a daily basis?
Naseem Rochette: And, you know, once, you know, once we can figure out some idea of that,
Naseem Rochette: it's. How do we reach that state more often? Are you less tolerant of
Joanne Lockwood: people? More tolerant of people? Now, let's see. I.
Naseem Rochette: I don't. That's a good question. I mean, honestly, my kids like to call me
Naseem Rochette: a little judgy, but I'm. Just thinking in terms of, you know, what
Joanne Lockwood: you're saying about joy, and it's not bringing you joy, it's bringing you stress. Do
Joanne Lockwood: you. Do you apply that principle to relationships where you think, hang on a minute.
Joanne Lockwood: You are not bringing me joy in this relationship. We. We are not compatible anymore.
Joanne Lockwood: I'm out. Yeah. You know, I. I don't know that I'm. I.
Naseem Rochette: I definitely direct my life towards the joy. I don't know that I'd say. I'm
Naseem Rochette: like, I try to, as. As we talked about earlier, accept People where they are,
Naseem Rochette: and if they're in a place that isn't right for me,
Naseem Rochette: then I'll just try to spend less time with them. But when the time that
Naseem Rochette: I spend with them, I try to be as giving and kind and
Naseem Rochette: tolerant, you know, as I can be. Because, you know, as we. We've talked about,
Naseem Rochette: people feeling connected is so
Naseem Rochette: important and sometimes just
Naseem Rochette: accepting that if we build a better connection,
Naseem Rochette: the engagement or relationship might. Might evolve
Naseem Rochette: and drastically improve. You know, sometimes I get, you know, I'll hear
Naseem Rochette: people, you know, sometimes people are grumpy, you know, and I'll. For instance, you
Naseem Rochette: know, I try not to judge someone in that moment, you know, but think about
Naseem Rochette: what. Why are they in that state? You know, just like you had talked about
Naseem Rochette: earlier, meeting them where they are. So I try to be tolerant in that
Naseem Rochette: way and giving them more grace and kindness. So maybe I'm
Naseem Rochette: less, you know, when something someone said to me a year
Naseem Rochette: after the accident was, they. They told me that I was. Before the accident, I
Naseem Rochette: was an unsympathetic character that, you know, I kind of had
Naseem Rochette: it put together and, you know, I look like it was easy and, you know,
Naseem Rochette: not that any of it was, but I was proud of that. You
Joanne Lockwood: had a Persona. Yeah. And I shit together. Persona sort of thing.
Naseem Rochette: Yes, exactly. You know, and so now I try to make me
Naseem Rochette: more vulnerable so that, you know,
Naseem Rochette: other people that I can be more accepting and open
Naseem Rochette: and inclusive to people connecting.
Naseem Rochette: Because often the people that are. I might have been judgy about
Naseem Rochette: are just feeling alone. That must be part of your superpower,
Joanne Lockwood: which is radiating joyful energy. So if you go
Joanne Lockwood: in with a frown, that's not radiating joyful energy, is it? So my
Joanne Lockwood: approach is I tend to turn the volume down on people that
Joanne Lockwood: don't bring me joy. There's a phrase, hang out with radiators,
Joanne Lockwood: not drains. Drains will steal your energy. I'm stealing that.
Joanne Lockwood: Dementors from Harry Potter. They suck the energy out of you. So
Joanne Lockwood: on social media, what I do is I unfollow somebody. If I don't want to
Joanne Lockwood: hear from them, I don't go into their post and tell them what I
Joanne Lockwood: think. I just turn the volume down to unfollow. That way, if they want to
Joanne Lockwood: keep following me, they want to still see me, they want to still get value
Joanne Lockwood: from that relationship, that's fine. And if they. They bump into me, I'm still there.
Joanne Lockwood: And so I think blocking and unfriending and things like that are very.
Joanne Lockwood: They're very proactive. States to get people out of your life. Turn the volume down.
Joanne Lockwood: Your noise doesn't bring me joy. That's fine, doesn't matter. It brings other people
Joanne Lockwood: joy. That's up to them. So, yeah, turn the volume down.
Naseem Rochette: Do that too. And actually, speaking of social media, you know, one of the things
Naseem Rochette: that I think is important to talk
Naseem Rochette: about now and is that, like, you know, I talked to my, you know, my
Naseem Rochette: kids are teenagers and in college or kind of adult kids, but, you know, when
Naseem Rochette: people are always posting just like, oh, my life is so great
Naseem Rochette: and perfect, you know, they don't. I think people don't realise
Naseem Rochette: they're making themselves unsympathetic characters and they're
Naseem Rochette: losing connection with people, you know, and I think, you know,
Naseem Rochette: so one of the things that I do often in my talks is also try
Naseem Rochette: to remind people that, you know, if you're not showing the whole picture
Naseem Rochette: or sharing the whole picture, you're. You're
Naseem Rochette: losing out on the joy of connections. I think
Joanne Lockwood: when you think you talk about influencers and people that like that, and it has
Joanne Lockwood: to be authentic, authentic vulnerability, not plastic
Joanne Lockwood: or fake Barbie vulnerability. It's like, I'm having a really bad
Joanne Lockwood: day. Everything's really awful today. And if you're not careful, you're trying to use that
Joanne Lockwood: deliberate to, to bring people in with, you know, if you really are having a
Joanne Lockwood: bad day, be honest. Yeah, yeah,
Naseem Rochette: yeah. So you can say something like, yeah, it's. It's a
Naseem Rochette: tough day. Send me your good energy, you know?
Joanne Lockwood: Yeah. Why? Yeah, why? Just sometimes you leave it hanging, don't you?
Joanne Lockwood: I'm having a really bad one today. What is it? What is it? What is
Joanne Lockwood: it? Everyone keen to find out, you know. Oh, no, I can't say. Well, if
Joanne Lockwood: you can't say, why tell me in the first place? If your dog died, tell
Joanne Lockwood: us your dog died, you know, and then we'll go, oh, my lovely picture. Let's
Joanne Lockwood: do that. Or if you haven't had kids, have messed up, or if you've been
Joanne Lockwood: run over three times, just get it out. There, get it out there.
Naseem Rochette: Or, you know, just share it with people. The other question I've been keen to
Joanne Lockwood: ask you is, obviously this had a huge, big,
Joanne Lockwood: traumatic. At the time you were injured, you had organs that
Joanne Lockwood: were crushed and nerve injuries and things like
Joanne Lockwood: that. How long did it take you to get to a point where you felt
Joanne Lockwood: normal again, whatever that may mean? I don't. I don't know what normal means, but
Joanne Lockwood: kind of back, back to a. I'm. I'm Good enough now. When,
Naseem Rochette: when the accident first happened and I found out I didn't break any bones.
Naseem Rochette: And I'm sorry about all that beeping. I. I actually said to my
Naseem Rochette: husband, I said, call my boss and tell him I'll be back to work on
Naseem Rochette: Thursday. This was a Monday. Cause I was like, if I didn't break any
Naseem Rochette: bones, you know, I'm sure I can go back to. Yeah, I'm just faking it
Joanne Lockwood: otherwise, aren't I? Just faking it. That's exactly right. Like, yeah, I
Naseem Rochette: didn't give myself any, you know, any grace. Obviously. I did not go back to
Naseem Rochette: work on Thursday. And it took me a long, you know, the
Naseem Rochette: recovery was very long. But my
Naseem Rochette: engagement back into my old life was.
Naseem Rochette: Was quick, maybe too quick. So I went back to work after
Naseem Rochette: eight weeks, you know, against doctor's orders. And
Naseem Rochette: I just felt like I needed to, like you said, feel like I wanted to
Naseem Rochette: feel normal. And for me, that was getting back to work and, you
Naseem Rochette: know, earning and supporting my family. And my. Actually my
Naseem Rochette: babysitter said the day that I went back to work, my kids
Naseem Rochette: were like different kids because they thought life would never be the same again.
Naseem Rochette: However, I went back to work and it was much too soon and
Naseem Rochette: I didn't have the physical or mental energy like I. I
Naseem Rochette: would still needed to sleep 16 hours, days. And so unfortunately, I
Naseem Rochette: gave my energy to work and then I had nothing for my
Naseem Rochette: family. And that probably took. And so, you know, I was still. And I was
Naseem Rochette: still a very unpredictable person. You know, I hadn't. It took me a long time
Naseem Rochette: to regulate my emotions. You know, it probably. I would say it was like a
Naseem Rochette: year and a half before I felt normal,
Naseem Rochette: but it wasn't the same. You know, it was a new normal.
Naseem Rochette: And you know, even now, I mean, I have, you know, I have a,
Naseem Rochette: you know, bad knee, I have, you know, back pain, neck
Naseem Rochette: pain, they're issues. You know, I can't bear music in multiple
Naseem Rochette: rooms. You know, I'm. Lots of sensitivities because of my brain injury,
Naseem Rochette: but that is my new normal. And so I don't think about those
Naseem Rochette: things. You know, it's just my new normal. And every day is.
Joanne Lockwood: It's more normal. It just who you are. And you put up a legacy.
Joanne Lockwood: You now got history of who you are now. Yes. And I, you know, and
Naseem Rochette: I don't. And I'm not judging myself that I'm not that person that I was
Naseem Rochette: before. You know, I don't juggle like, I used to be a master of chaos
Naseem Rochette: and, you know, juggling a hundred things, you know, with
Naseem Rochette: loud, like, you know, even like clubbing at 3 o' clock in the morning, loud
Naseem Rochette: concerts, like, I loved all that extra stimulation. I
Naseem Rochette: can't tolerate or bear that anymore. But, you know, that's okay because
Naseem Rochette: I'm appreciating different things, you know, and I'll brag for a minute and that,
Naseem Rochette: you know, much to my surprise, when I went back to work, I thought
Naseem Rochette: I was never going to be as good as I used to be because I
Naseem Rochette: can't solve problems in the same way. But it
Naseem Rochette: turns out the new ways in which I solve problems and delve into things
Naseem Rochette: has been more successful for me. You know, with a traumatic
Naseem Rochette: brain injury, I've. I've actually, you know, been better able
Naseem Rochette: to serve my teams and my clients. So apart from Joy.
Joanne Lockwood: Apart from Joy, what is the one thing that you're most proud
Joanne Lockwood: of about you? Now that wouldn't have
Joanne Lockwood: occurred had it not been for Unbreakable Day? I think it's.
Naseem Rochette: It's really my ability to share what I thought was weakness,
Naseem Rochette: to share struggle and journey and understand
Naseem Rochette: what it feels like and how to relate
Naseem Rochette: to people when they're going through something tough, you know, for instance,
Naseem Rochette: like, you know, when. When someone goes through a death, you know, or a trauma,
Naseem Rochette: I think many people are very uncomfortable with, you know, what do you say?
Naseem Rochette: How do you respond, how do you act? Because of
Naseem Rochette: these experiences and because I think I've taken the time to
Naseem Rochette: explore what I've learned and how I've changed, I
Naseem Rochette: am. I don't feel as awkward, you know, in those moments, I
Naseem Rochette: can. I know that, you know, when somebody dies, like my saying I'm sorry about
Naseem Rochette: your loss isn't bringing it up because they're thinking about it all the time.
Naseem Rochette: You know, I know they're. And they appreciate that warmth and that connection.
Naseem Rochette: I know that now that when somebody's in trauma, asking them
Naseem Rochette: how they are is a really tough question because they don't know
Naseem Rochette: how they are and they don't want to lie to you and they don't want
Naseem Rochette: to pretend everything's fine. And so you're. You're making them do all this work internally.
Naseem Rochette: Whereas if I just say I'm thinking about you, I'm here for you. You
Naseem Rochette: know, a statement, not a question, I make it easier on them.
Naseem Rochette: So, you know, I think the other thing, you know, that's just. Just how to
Naseem Rochette: relate to people in those tough moments. You know, I'm. I'm
Naseem Rochette: lucky that I can. A fantastic conversation and
Joanne Lockwood: in a way, I'm really pleased. I didn't do too much research and I heard
Joanne Lockwood: the storey at the same time as you listening. You
Joanne Lockwood: got that kind of. Whoa. And I sat here and you said my face was
Joanne Lockwood: a picture. I was literally stunned into sort of silence as I
Joanne Lockwood: was picturing June Osborne in Handmaid's Tale being
Joanne Lockwood: run over by the red rv, which I'd now ruined. Spoiler. Now I've got to
Naseem Rochette: go. There you go. Watch it. How
Joanne Lockwood: can people get hold of you? Tell us about your book. Tell us about your
Joanne Lockwood: website and everything. Yeah, so my book is called the
Naseem Rochette: Unexpected Benefits Of Being Run Over. You can pretty much get it, you
Naseem Rochette: know, wherever books are sold or order. It certainly is on
Naseem Rochette: Amazon. And on Amazon, you can also get my audible, which is me
Naseem Rochette: telling the storey. So if you want to, you know, want to hear it
Naseem Rochette: and, you know, I've got a website, Naseem rochette.com where you can
Naseem Rochette: reach out if you, you know, you're interested in coaching or, you know,
Naseem Rochette: speaking or, you know, or LinkedIn. I'd love to say that I post a lot
Naseem Rochette: on social and share wisdom, but I'm not good at
Naseem Rochette: that yet, so. So you can buy my book on Amazon or
Naseem Rochette: reach out on Naseem Rochette.com. Thank you so much. It's been
Joanne Lockwood: amazing. Oh, thank you, Jo. Thanks, everybody, for listening.
Joanne Lockwood: Bye. As we bring
Joanne Lockwood: this conversation to a close, I want to express my deepest
Joanne Lockwood: gratitude to you, our listener, for lending your ear
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